Do I lose edgelord status if moving from arch to debian?

friend-of-linus

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Having used arch for almost 10 years, how time flies, I fancied a change as the constant push to do full updates is my main gripe with it.

I originally chose it, not knowing much about it, because I read it was very modular and you can make a minimal system and build from there.

I was not disappointed in that regard but the constant push to always be upgrading has gotten on my nerves. Now, in hindsight the problems in the past were mostly because I would only upgrade when I absolutely could not avoid it when I was getting loads of shared library errors when I wanted to install a new package with the much discourage partial upgrade of
Code:
pacman -S package-name
.

Having reluctantly started doing things 'by the book' and doing full system upgrades mostly when I install a new package, which is perhaps every couple of months, things have gone much smoother in that regard with no huge several day's productivity destroying breakages of old.

Having run debian on a few servers over the years I much prefer the glacial update ethos so thinking to give it a whirl as my main desktop OS on another laptop I have been gifted.

As most in the linux community will know arch users have the biggest chips on their shoulders out of any other distro, at least that I have come across. Why is that? I mean there are more 'hardcore' distros out there like slack or linux from scratch and having asked some questions on the slack forums before people are way more down to earth than the arch neckbeard wizards.b

Going to debian I feel will be going down on the totem pole and can no longer count myself among those elite breed of the linux fraternity.

I had given Slack serious consideration to not lose points in that regard and indeed perhaps earn myself some more accolades however upon learning it is about as far from minimal in design philosophy as you can get, cool rationality swayed me away from that choice.

I plan to do a minimal netinst of the classic, Debian, and install ratpoison DE as per my arch install.

I had read around for other minimal distros and most times they were some debian flavour, AntiX, Peppermint, anyway so I thought, upon reading recommendations of the same, why not go straight to the source with a minimal debian install?
 


Turn it on its head, you have come to the common sense decision not to waste so much time to maintain a system and use something that just works
FYI, Debian and Slack wear are the oldest of the current Distros Red Hat and SUSE are about 18 months younger, LFS is the odd one out and may be considered a hobbyist build often taking a lot of time to maintain, age wise it falls between Debian and Redhat

edit
I forgot ARCH is the baby on the block, its only 23 yrs old [2002] I have been using Debian longer than that
 
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As most in the linux community will know arch users have the biggest chips on their shoulders out of any other distro, at least that I have come across. Why is that?
Pride and lack of maturity.

Just because I've ran Slackware for 13 years doesn't give me, you or any other Linux user {edgelord status} this has been discussed here many times.

With Debian I feel you can't go wrong. :)
I've been running it for 7 years plus as has @JasKinasis , @osprey, @CaffeineAddict and @wizardfromoz

Anything that I lacked from the netinstall in the past I used APT to find it and install it. You can also use Synaptic or just go directly to the Debian repo and download the .deb pkg or packages.

The authoritative documentation from Debian is well done and helpful.


All the best with your fresh install of Debian.
Alex
 
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Pride and lack of maturity.

Just because I've ran Slackware for 13 years doesn't give me, you or any other Linux user {edgelord status} this has been discussed here many times.

With Debian I feel you can't go wrong. :)
I've been running it for 7 years plus as has @JasKinasis , @osprey, @CaffeineAddict and @wizardfromoz

Anything that I lacked from the netinstall in the past I used APT to find it and install it. You can also use Synaptic or just go directly to the Debian repo and download the .deb pkg or packages.

The authoritative documentation from Debian is well done and helpful.


All the best with your fresh install of Debian.
Alex
Thanks, my title was tongue in cheek and I probably should have made a more productive one or at least sub title.

However the post itself I do go into my genuine thoughts on the matter.

I am interested if debian netinst is a good choice for my intended use case. Well I have downloaded it now and made my mind up I just want to be told it was a good choice now, lol. Seemed like a good bet, especially since my previous bit of experience with it on servers and so already have a taste of it.

I would say it is still the minimalism I like with what I am thinking the added stability of point release.

Oh your comments do raise a legitimate question. I find the archwiki has been second to none and that even when I was on those debian servers I would go back to the archwiki if it was for a general linux piece of software.

Will that link see me right for debian specific issues? I know there is a lot of documentation in general for debian, both source and 3rd party but in the past I have not found it as accessible as the archwiki, which I have found second to none.

Archies don't suffer fools gladly but if I can weather their rancor they do distill information down extremely well.
 
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Do I lose edgelord status if moving from arch to debian?​

No, use what works for you and change every now and then is good for you. In the last 4 years I've switched around quite a bit to try some distributions I ran before and others which I hadn't tried yet. I had fun and it was good to experience a distribution I had run as my daily driver before again, as well as two other distributions I had not tried yet. Now I am back on Arch because having bought a new gpu that just came out this year it was just easier to use Arch and I did miss having Arch as my system, as well as some PKGBUILDS from the AUR.

Also, welcome to the forums!
 
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No, use what works for you and change every now and then is good for you. I the last 4 years I've switched around quite a bit to try some distributions I liked again. I had fun and it was good to experience a distribution I had run as my daily driver again, as well as two other distributions I had not tried yet. Now I am back on Arch because having bought a new gpu that just came out this year it was just easier to use Arch and I did miss having Arch as my system, as well as some PKGBUILDS from the AUR.

Also, welcome to the forums!
Cheers,

Also, just reading the gags about arch users online now, I can't help but summarize your comment, "I am back on Arch, btw". :p
 
Also, reading reading the gags now, I can't help but summarise your comment, "I am back on Arch, btw". :p
LOL Distributions I ran these last 4 years. Fedora Silverblue, NixOS, Fedora Workstation and then back on Arch Linux. The summery is true but it wasn't my point, just use what's best for you. I can imagine that at some point you don't want to have to deal with Arch problems that's one reason why I decided to try Sillverblue and while I was at it decided to try NixOS and then I was back on Silverblue and then Fedora again.

I did end back up on Arch but I switched back to Arch Linux to to test out if I would experience some kernel bug that I was experiencing that was causing a freeze/reset of my AMD gpu once or twice a day. In the end the problem was there too, I then switch back to an Nvidia gpu. I stuck with Arch Linux because I found it just easier with the nvidia-open drivers and I did honestly miss Arch Linux.

Point of the story is, it's always good try something new if you are are bored or tired of something and use what works for you.
 
LOL Distributions I ran these last 4 years. Fedora Silverblue, NixOS, Fedora Workstation and then back on Arch Linux. The summery is true but it wasn't my point, just use what's best for you. I can imagine that at some point you don't want to have to deal with Arch problems that's one reason why I decided to try Sillverblue and while I was at it decided to try NixOS and then I was back on Silverblue and then Fedora again.

I did end back up on Arch but I switched back to Arch Linux to to test out if I would experience some kernel bug that I was experiencing that was causing a freeze/reset of my AMD gpu once or twice a day. In the end the problem was there too, I then switch back to an Nvidia gpu. I stuck with Arch Linux because I found it just easier with the nvidia-open drivers and I did honestly miss Arch Linux.

Point of the story is, it's always good try something new if you are are bored or tired of something and use what works for you.
By the way, tbh I was already getting 'homesick' when I read that debian is installed by gui. Is there a way to make it more 'hardcore' and install cli like arch as I do still like the debian philosophy but I am a proud cli warrior.

It is not pride though, jokes aside, I just like the control of the cli. I guess it is inconsequential once the initial install is finished whether it was done with the cli or not as, with a netinst, minimal install, I will be at the terminal prompt anyway so doesn't really matter how I got there.

Just for comparison I also found out not long ago that slack, the most hardcore mythical one of them all, or up there, also installs with a gui and kitchen sink applications. That is what turned me off. They talked about control, which interested me, but the install philosophy is install everything you may every want to use and hundreds you may never use which was totally against my minimalist penchant.
 
By the way, tbh I was already getting 'homesick' when I read that debian is installed by gui. Is there a way to make it more 'hardcore' and install cli like arch as I do still like the debian philosophy but I am a proud cli warrior.
Maybe something like this? ;)
 
I've used Arch for fairly long stretches. I've even used Gentoo and done both LFS and BLFS. Slackware was fun for a while.

Basically, the point I'm trying to make is that I've used all the 'hard' ways. I didn't do it for geek cred. I did it for educational reasons and to have new experiences. At the time, I was quite keen on learning the inner workings and I'd tweak to no end. I'd bounce around on the different systems, running multiple distros on multiple devices.

So, if I had geek cred, it was surely a lot of it. I never really cared and just did my own thing as I wanted to. I think the latter is true geek cred.

These days, I pretty much only use Lubuntu - except for one system that has Linux Mint on it. I've had Mint on that for a couple of years and I like it well enough. I do grow tired of it and will probably consider switching it to a different OS. I probably won't do that until I either break something or upgrade the system. So, we'll see...

But, geek cred is knowingly doing what you want to do because you want your needs met in the best possible manner. It's understanding the technology and choices so that you can get your work done in an efficient and effective manner.
 
Going to debian I feel will be going down on the totem pole and can no longer count myself among those elite breed of the linux fraternity.
Welcome to Linux.org

You can now relax. You are among those who are at the very heart of Linux.
 
Thanks, my title was tongue in cheek and I probably should have made a more productive one or at least sub title.

However the post itself I do go into my genuine thoughts on the matter.

I am interested if debian netinst is a good choice for my intended use case. Well I have downloaded it now and made my mind up I just want to be told it was a good choice now, lol. Seemed like a good bet, especially since my previous bit of experience with it on servers and so already have a taste of it.

I would say it is still the minimalism I like with what I am thinking the added stability of point release.

Oh your comments do raise a legitimate question. I find the archwiki has been second to none and that even when I was on those debian servers I would go back to the archwiki if it was for a general linux piece of software.

Will that link see me right for debian specific issues? I know there is a lot of documentation in general for debian, both source and 3rd party but in the past I have not found it as accessible as the archwiki, which I have found second to none.

Archies don't suffer fools gladly but if I can weather their rancor they do distill information down extremely well.
No, I don't think that link will be for specific Debian issues. That is for the ADMIN's Handbook and general documentation for Debian.

And, yes, I agree.
The Arch Wiki's and general doc's are very helpful.

If you are experiencing specific issue's you can use your fav search engine to find the solution or post here in the Debian Forum.

Do tell when your fresh install is finished.
 
By the way, tbh I was already getting 'homesick' when I read that debian is installed by gui. Is there a way to make it more 'hardcore' and install cli like arch as I do still like the debian philosophy but I am a proud cli warrior.

It is not pride though, jokes aside, I just like the control of the cli. I guess it is inconsequential once the initial install is finished whether it was done with the cli or not as, with a netinst, minimal install, I will be at the terminal prompt anyway so doesn't really matter how I got there.

Just for comparison I also found out not long ago that slack, the most hardcore mythical one of them all, or up there, also installs with a gui and kitchen sink applications. That is what turned me off. They talked about control, which interested me, but the install philosophy is install everything you may every want to use and hundreds you may never use which was totally against my minimalist penchant.
You should be able to install it in text mode if you'd like.
Just follow the installers prompts and skip the GUI mode.

 
You should be able to install it in text mode if you'd like.
Just follow the installers prompts and skip the GUI mode.

Actually as it is the first time I have installed I will do it by the book to get a feel for the intended experience.
 
Going to debian I feel will be going down on the totem pole and can no longer count myself among those elite breed of the linux fraternity.
Lol..!!

Does it really matter? And TBH.....who cares?

So long as I can achieve what I want to do - by whatever means necessary - I couldn't care less HOW I get there, or what anybody else might think of me. Yes, sightseeing is nice (think distro-hopping) but at the end of the day, reaching your destination is, ultimately, more important than the journey itself...

Perhaps you're a nomad.....one who likes being constantly on the move, never settling anywhere. Or you may be like the majority.....who like settled, secure stability. Both viewpoints are easily accommodated by the many spins & flavours of the Linux ecosystem.

I moved to Linux literally overnight, around 11 years ago. Wiped Whinedoze out of my life AND dived headfirst into this immense new sea of possibilities within 24 hours. Started with Ubuntu, distro-hopped for a few months (I like to "get my bearings" whenever I move to a new place!), then due to aging hardware issues & a limited budget, found my way to 'Puppy' Linux...

...and I've been there ever since. You would HATE it. It'd drive ya nuts!

Not because she's particularly awkward - far from it - but because Puppy does things in her own inimitable way. Ya want a new piece of software? You don't install it.....you 'load' it when you want to run it, then 'unload' when you're done. You want to change summat in the file-system? We dive into the file-system & physically move stuff around to suit ourselves. Puppy 'runs as root' - like the 'bad old days'. There's no constant asking your system's permission to do stuff; you just do it. After a few breakages, ya soon learn to to be careful....

I don't expect others to understand, but Puppy teaches discipline. You haven't even got the sudo 'cushion' to fall back on. You are truly the master of your own destiny.....and it opens up a whole raft of possibilities that just aren't normally there.

2-minute installs/re-installs from locked, read-only files. 5-minute backups or restores. Total flexibility as to how (and from where) you run it. What's not to like..? :P

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~​

At the end of the day, any OS is about the software you can run on it, and what you can actually DO with it. It's a 'means to an end'; without software, it's a bit pointless.....truthfully, I simply do not understand those for whom the OS itself appears to be everything, and endless installing/setting-up/uninstalling defines their entire Linux experience.

Huh??? :confused:

Still; if it makes 'em happy.....good luck to them. I have no fault to find. I just don't understand it.

(shrug...)


Mike. ;)
 
..and I've been there ever since.
And they called it puppy love
Oh, I guess they'll never know
How a young heart really feels
And why I love her so

Ack P. Anchor
 
Hi guys, so I started trying to install it on the other machine and after getting past (disabling, which I figured out with a bit of fiddling/guessing) secure boot at the failed USB boot, nothing to do with linux, I was on my way into the debian install process but quickly hit a BIG hurdle.

Being net install I forgot I have an idiosyncratic internet setup as I am using which is 4g mobile internet dongle.

I have set it up on arch using the mythical archwiki here. In short, modemmanager and networkmanager. Now I am not sure how I will do that out the gate on debian installer?

I noticed there is a terminal you can go into so should I just download the packages I will want, will it just be those two? and load them from the prompt? As I am familiar with pacman usage I would have to know how to do the equivalent in debian. I have used apt before, but that was for repos so I imagine that this process would be more like installing an aur package on arch?

I won't get very far with a net install without internet. :p

EDIT: Just having a quick look before taking a break but seems well covered for installing packages offline, just not sure how many dependencies there will be to also install.

Been a couple of years since I set it up on the arch machine too and can't recall if there were other steps. We shall see.
 
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Hello @friend-of-linus
Welcome the the Linux.org forum,
If it were me and I've run a number of distro since 1996, Debian one of my favorites Just go with the one that best suit your needs. Debian is a good choice but you must understand that they are zeroed in on stability and not cutting edge. updates other than for security reasons are slow in coming. You can install a minimal net install with cli if you wish. Of late I've become sort of lazy and thus go with Mint as it meats my needs and requires less work. But Debian is a good solid distro, I tested trixie Debian 13 for about 1 month and found it to be solid and dependable with KDE 6 DE. It won't go final for a couple months yet but it never gave any serious problems here. So choose what ever works best for you and don't worry too much about what others may think. You may want to give LMDE 6 a spin also. Cheers!
 
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