Best Linux distro for a 20-year-old ThinkPad
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CaffeineAddict
Well-Known Member
So it didn't work, why not listening to what the site says?
I can't judge as I've never tried it.
The website just says "at the time of writing this" it was written before Debian 12 was released.
Oh sorry so, but you were not even borne when I gave up servicing IBM branded kit
I can only think of 2 that may run, Anti-x -32 bit or Zorin lite -32 bit
your biggest problem is GPU drivers if the above dont work, I dont give much hope but i will have a word with a few of my cohorts to see if they know of legacy drivers for you [wont have an answer till tomorrow probably around 1900 hrs GMT/Zulu
CaffeineAddict
Well-Known Member
APT in Debian 12 most likely pulls in 64 bit packages by default, so you may need to
sudo dpkg --add-architecture i386 and then sudo apt updateYou may also need to manually pull in 32 bit packages.
the sheet i have copied to the forum is from the work sheet for the Intel Pentium M 740 (Socket 479) CPU as fitted originally to that machine
The only problem is no support and no access to the now depleted repositories,
time for bed.. good night
bye! you can answer this tommorow, but is it not based on Debian bookworm? And wouldn't that still be supported? On the linux mint download page it has it marked as long-term support, I am not sure what they mean by that.
There are fewer packages available in 32-bit Debian repositories compared to 64-bit repositories basically because there's less 32-bit hardware in circulation or in common usage so developers just concentrate on 64-bit stuff. The demand for 32-bit software is just increasingly rare.
It's just that modern software makes use of more memory and processing power so 32-bit machines lose out with developers who are improving their software for the majority of their "audience" and also possibly taking advantage of the never-ending cycle of hardware developments.
Although this isn't an option on your machine, debian, like some other distributions, has implemented "multiarch" capabilities which allows 64-bit systems to run 32-bit applications by installing necessary 32-bit libraries. This reduces the need for a completely separate and fully maintained 32-bit repository for all packages. The consequence of that is that there just aren't the same number of 32-bit packages as there are for 64-bit. Obsolescence and maintainerless packages can just go by the wayside and vanish from repos too further diminishing the number of packages available for 32-bit machines. In such cases, apt simply won't find a number of packages common on 64-bit for the 32-bit architecture.
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Thanks for your comment.
To make a suggestion for you, taking into consideration your interests and intentions, I cannot do because of lack of information. However, the following is what I would try with the machine.
Install only text mode applications. The reason is that they will in all likelihood work flawlessly and fast. If you like games, explore the text mode games in the packages: bsdgames, and bsdgames-nonfree. Internet would be available in text mode with packages like: lynx, elinks, w3m. Of course a lot of online content would be unavailable, but anything with text is likely to be accessible. If you were interested in programming, the programming tools would be available. Scripts and apps could be created. In other words, there's a heap of things available for such a limited machine, but the upshot is that each application is going to require significant learning, and the learning curve in this approach is rather large. The long term benefit of such learning is incalculably beneficial for someone whose interests extend into the IT world. This may be totally unrealistic for you, but you did ask
.
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Nope, sorry; it doesn't.
There were two variants of the Pentium M.....both of which were based around the Pentium 4 "NetBurst" architecture, and which only ever went as far as SSE2 support (the P4 was the CPU on which Intel introduced SSE2 support to their product range).
Yes, later Pentium 4s did have SSE3 support, along with 64-bit capability.....but this wasn't until 'Prescott' came along ( a core variant with an unenviable reputation for gulping energy like it was going out of style & running as hot as a furnace.....and which introduced the concept of 'parasitic leakage' to the world as Intel attempted to push the P4 beyond 4 GHz).
Many CPUs manage well beyond 4 GHz these days, but 20-odd years ago, foundry technology was very much less advanced than it is now. Parasitic leakage led to the introduction of an entire new category of CPU 'fault', and it manifested itself primarily on the Netburst-architecture 'Northwood' P4 cores.....known as SNDS, or 'Sudden Northwood Death Syndrome'.
This happened to over-clockers who were pushing the clock speed boundaries of Netburst. Beyond a certain point, the core became increasingly unstable as electron currents migrated between core layers, ending up where they shouldn't be. Backing-off to slower clock speeds didn't help much, as the damage was by now already permanent. For many over-clockers, the CPU would literally 'die' within a matter of days after this.....
As demonstrated by my colleague @Brickwizard , we DO know what we're talking about.....some of us are old enough to remember this stuff first-hand, and a few may even have experienced SNDS for themselves.
Mike.
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I use Lynx, and I do program, this computer is for programming mainly. My one problem is that I need to be able to connect to google sheets online. What is a fast application that I can use to browse the web and access google sheets?
I have a bit of a saying...
"An old computer will perform the tasks it was designed to do as well as it did when it was purchased."
So, a computer that ran Windows XP like a champ will still run Windows XP like a champ. It's just that Windows XP isn't really a viable choice as a modern operating system.
There is some leeway. We're currently in a CPU "paradise", where a CPU 10 years old will happily run current Linux. Heck, it'll happily run current Windows 10 (or 11, if you can tell it to bypass the TPM 2.0 check).
But, these old computers aren't really worth using for modern tasks. They're great for doing what they were designed to do, but to do modern tasks with them would just be an inefficient waste of resources (such as electricity). It will cost you more money to do the same amount of work that you would do with more modern hardware.
I'm actually a big fan of retro computing. I just don't think we need to consume more resources unless we absolutely have to.
You're trying to do modern tasks on a system that's pretty old (if I read enough of the thread). It may not be reasonable for you to pick up a $100 refurbished computer, and I can relate to that. But, that $100 refurbished computer will be a much better experience for you and will be so much more efficient, meaning lower power bills.
Those power bill increases add up and they add up quickly. I once did the math for a Pentium 4 vs a used i7. Performing the same load on each would mean that in about a year and a half was the payoff time. The P4, over that year and a half, would cover the cost of the used i7 (in that instance).
Retro computing is great. It's a wonderful hobby. I'm not sure that I'd try to use an old system to accomplish meaningful tasks, especially online tasks, unless I absolutely had to.
Of course, if it's just for fun, have fun with it. I mean, sure, it's more energy but there are other hobbies that use far more energy than this one will.
That's a bit of a novella, but I wanted to make my thoughts on the matter reasonably clear.
By all means, keep doing what you're doing. Don't let me stop you. I'm merely sharing my views, which could easily be from a position of priviledge.
"An old computer will perform the tasks it was designed to do as well as it did when it was purchased."
So, a computer that ran Windows XP like a champ will still run Windows XP like a champ. It's just that Windows XP isn't really a viable choice as a modern operating system.
There is some leeway. We're currently in a CPU "paradise", where a CPU 10 years old will happily run current Linux. Heck, it'll happily run current Windows 10 (or 11, if you can tell it to bypass the TPM 2.0 check).
But, these old computers aren't really worth using for modern tasks. They're great for doing what they were designed to do, but to do modern tasks with them would just be an inefficient waste of resources (such as electricity). It will cost you more money to do the same amount of work that you would do with more modern hardware.
I'm actually a big fan of retro computing. I just don't think we need to consume more resources unless we absolutely have to.
You're trying to do modern tasks on a system that's pretty old (if I read enough of the thread). It may not be reasonable for you to pick up a $100 refurbished computer, and I can relate to that. But, that $100 refurbished computer will be a much better experience for you and will be so much more efficient, meaning lower power bills.
Those power bill increases add up and they add up quickly. I once did the math for a Pentium 4 vs a used i7. Performing the same load on each would mean that in about a year and a half was the payoff time. The P4, over that year and a half, would cover the cost of the used i7 (in that instance).
Retro computing is great. It's a wonderful hobby. I'm not sure that I'd try to use an old system to accomplish meaningful tasks, especially online tasks, unless I absolutely had to.
Of course, if it's just for fun, have fun with it. I mean, sure, it's more energy but there are other hobbies that use far more energy than this one will.
That's a bit of a novella, but I wanted to make my thoughts on the matter reasonably clear.
By all means, keep doing what you're doing. Don't let me stop you. I'm merely sharing my views, which could easily be from a position of priviledge.
Yes, it is mostly for fun. I used a 3d printed laptop that I designed for a while, but I fried the components in it. So, I bought this and have been working on fixing it up and getting it to work. I used my old linux laptop to open a google spreadsheet, and I would like to do so on this. My main problem is any time I try to use the apt function or the package manager it asks me to insert a cd-rm even though it says it has the packages. I need to get this working. Also, if I run
[sudo apt-get install neofetch]
it starts up and then shows an error saying neofetch was not found. But when I run
[sudo apt list]
it returns a list of all the packages, and I can scroll and find neofetch.
This is my biggest problem, The use of this laptop and anything else are not really important. I already know what I use it for. I mainly use it for Lynx, Libre Office, and terminal based applications. I also am a big fan of retro computing, I am 14 and of course, wasn't alive when these computers were big, but my dad was in college in the 1990s using red hat and my grandfather helped to design an early hard drive at western digital. I am interested in computing in general, and retro computing is a great way to get started. Especially because the ThinkPad is so highly customizable, and I can upgrade most components in it. It is very durable, but I do feel it was faster running Supermium in Windows XP than it is at running Firefox in Linux. Maybe Chromium is a better option. Installation will be hard because of the apt problems, but it should work. If Linux end up not working as well as I would like it to work, I will switch to ReactOS, it is like windows XP but still supported and updated, and opensource.
Thanks for your help.
[sudo apt-get install neofetch]
it starts up and then shows an error saying neofetch was not found. But when I run
[sudo apt list]
it returns a list of all the packages, and I can scroll and find neofetch.
This is my biggest problem, The use of this laptop and anything else are not really important. I already know what I use it for. I mainly use it for Lynx, Libre Office, and terminal based applications. I also am a big fan of retro computing, I am 14 and of course, wasn't alive when these computers were big, but my dad was in college in the 1990s using red hat and my grandfather helped to design an early hard drive at western digital. I am interested in computing in general, and retro computing is a great way to get started. Especially because the ThinkPad is so highly customizable, and I can upgrade most components in it. It is very durable, but I do feel it was faster running Supermium in Windows XP than it is at running Firefox in Linux. Maybe Chromium is a better option. Installation will be hard because of the apt problems, but it should work. If Linux end up not working as well as I would like it to work, I will switch to ReactOS, it is like windows XP but still supported and updated, and opensource.
Thanks for your help.
theLegionWithin
Well-Known Member
so here's the thing - x86 (aka 32-bit) distros are dying. Debian is dropping x86 support in 3 days when Trixie is released. all of the many, many Debian derived distros will do the same. there are other distro families you could go with but ultimately you're going ton run into the same issue - the 32-bit architecture will soon be entirely unsupported. obviously there are still some distros out there you could use but getting legacy hardware to do modern compute tasks will be nigh impossible.
imho any hardware 12 years or older is basically useless unless you're on the retro-computing track or it's an industrial computer (as those seldom get updated). my suggestion would be refer to this list and winnow down what will work with 20 year old hardware --> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Linux_distributions
imho any hardware 12 years or older is basically useless unless you're on the retro-computing track or it's an industrial computer (as those seldom get updated). my suggestion would be refer to this list and winnow down what will work with 20 year old hardware --> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Linux_distributions
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