New to Mint and initial problems.

[CaffeineAddict]

It's not a question of learning curve. I just looked through hundreds of problems on forums, that have not been solved. Like hundreds. And I get, an army of people trying to help. But so many of the issues on the forums are unresolved.

From my XP in at least 95% of cases questioners are unable to ask or follow properly their thread for various reasons.
I'd attribute at most 5% to the inability of forums helpers, and that 5% is a lot.

I my self don't even bother to take part in threads that I clearly see upfront a questioner is not fit to follow, even if I could possibly help to some degree, and I'm sure I'm not the only one.

The worrying thing is the amount of time invested just to try and get Mint to read a data SSD. And this is just the start, how much time will it take to solve the next problem?

Windows doesn't work perfectly all the time, why expecting everything to work in Linux?
It boils down to whether you're willing to learn new ways?

How easy will Linux be to you depends a lot on your background and existing skills,
If you want to embrace Linux and become super user or self sufficient you have to enjoy learning a lot of things about IT in general not just Linux specific stuff.

I'd say stuff like Linux is for people who are used to reading and learning, you have to put some effort in, to get results.
Younger folks will have easier time learning also, especially if they know very little or nothing.

If Linux's intention is to grow as a platform, well I am not sure any real growth is going to happen. I hear about millions of downloads. I wonder how many people are actually still using it and how many have given up.

I switched to Linux literary over night and didn't give up, managed to overcome almost all problems without help, but I have some background that most users don't.

Some other people will brute force Linux through learning, and there will always be those who want it just work without any effort on their part, to their disappointment.

 

[Condobloke]

Linux is NOT Windows

 

[bob466]

Linux isn't a free copy of windoze and Linux Mint isn't a beginners Distro either.

There seems to be an ever-increasing number of beginners that I've noticed who blame Mint for the problems they create.

 

[Condobloke]

There seems to be an ever-increasing number of beginners that I've noticed who blame Mint for the problems they create.

That is a fact. Linux Mint is a well behaved distro.
A new users inability to 'make it work' is more a reflection of the users inability to install/boot it, or perhaps poor instructions on how to do so, or misinterpretation of those instructions.

I am yet to be convinced that there is a beginner's distro. There are distros which have more people using them and therefore have a much broader support base. eg, Linux Mint.

 

[bob466]

OP said..."I've watched all the youtube videos and worked with computers as far back as DOS".

You'd think a person with all that experience would be able to install Mint and connect a few internal storage Drives...it's not that hard.

 

[KGIII]

I am yet to be convinced that there is a beginner's distro.

I can get down with that.

Along the way, there have been tools that made things easier to adopt Linux. There have been distros that are ideologically 'user-friendly'. It should be noted that not all of those things were remembered by the first to do so. For example, we remember Knoppix for having the live environment, the ability to run it off of a CD. Yet, the first 'live Linux' was created just a couple of years after Linux was released to the world, done by some group who made Yggdrasil Linux.

Then, there was the first GUI installation tool...

The first GUI file manager...

Hell, the first GUI...

The first GUI partition manager...

All those things (and more than I'll mention) help make things easier for a beginner. These days, most any distro out there will be similarly easy to install and operate. Sure, there are exceptions, but they're not really the norm/most popular.

 

[Gareth]

I think the OP is going to have problems with any Distro...especially claiming problems getting Mint to read data SSDs. View attachment 29576

Have a little think about what you just said, and it's really sad to see a grown-up trying to find an emoji of a wagging finger - seriously, get a life.

So you think I signed up for this forum to post an imaginary problem? I think that says a lot more about you than me.

I did wonder how tribal and insecure some people might be and I guess I found out pretty quickly.

I am not saying that Zorin is better than Mint, not at all. I am saying that someone advised me to try it and it worked. And there really is no reason to shoot the messenger. There are a lot of people migrating from Windows to Linux and those people will be looking for a distro that they can recognise (at least in part), that at least has a GUI that works and doesn't rely on the terminal. You'll be surprised to hear that most people using computers don't use a terminal ever, they are not used to it.

Linux it appears has two directions to go, it can maintain it's very niche part in the desktop world or it can move onwards and claim a very large chunk of it. For some traditionalists, well they will want to stay in their own world but the people driving a lot of the distros appear to be making them more and more user friendly.

 

[Brickwizard]

It boils down to a list of people and their desires
Mr a, has an old computer, he is fed up with windows, has done some research and decided he wants shot of window and will do anything to achieve that aim
Mr b, has an old Windows machine and would like to change as long as there is no work involved
Mr c, doesn't give a damn and believes any replacement should, looks like windows, works like windows runs windows programs and cost nothing
Mr D, I don't know why I am trying this, it's not like windows and why should i get involved with the terminal, i don't have to in windows
Finally, Master X, I want to use Linux but i am told i can't! Play games, talk to my family, read my student assignments & infinitum

 

[Gareth]

It boils down to a list of people and their desires
Mr a, has an old computer, he is fed up with windows, has done some research and decided he wants shot of window and will do anything to achieve that aim
Mr b, has an old Windows machine and would like to change as long as there is no work involved
Mr c, dost give a damn and believes any replacement should, looks like windows, works like windows runs windows programs and cost nothing
Mr D, I don't know why I am trying this, it's not like windows and why should i get involved with the terminal, i don't have to in windows
Finally Master X, I want to use Linux but i am told i cant! play games, talk to my family, read my student assignments & infinitum

I think over the next year or two, you will see a lot of people who are experienced Windows users leaving and looking for a home elsewhere. Win11 is going to be Microsoft's Vista and Win8 all rolled into one, and more.
Most of these people won't be driven by cost but by simply leaving the reliance of an untrustworthy company, privacy, security and peace of mind. Pretty much your first scenario.
The question is whether the Linux community want those people. Some seem to, many appear not to. I am sure some people inside think that they are pretty smart because they can do so many things with a Linux terminal that most people don't have a clue about. I am sure they feel very threatened by the idea of an easy GUI that would reduce the need of the terminal and their own importance.
Linux has amazing potential. It can create a seismic change in the desktop/laptop world. Microsoft's bet is that people will put up with Microsoft owning all the data about their lives and selling it to the highest bidder because the alternative is too difficult to cope with. The distro that can make that migration as easy as possible stands to very successful.

 

[f33dm3bits]

You'd think a person with all that experience would be able to install Mint and connect a few internal storage Drives...it's not that hard.

It's about preference and what will work for a person, in the beginning just about figuring out what works and what gets you the best user experience. In the beginning most people distro-hop and later stick to something. Nothing bad about a person trying different distributions, that way they get a better picture of what all is out there that they might like and what gives them the best experience. There are different paths for everyone as in how they get to where they want to get when it comes to Linux. Just like not everyone's end path is Arch Linux, as well as not everyone best first distribution is Linux Mint.

I am not saying that Zorin is better than Mint, not at all. I am saying that someone advised me to try it and it worked.

That's all good. It's good that you are doing it your way and trying out different distributions. It's your Linux journey, not everyone has the same destination. Also good that you are trying out things out yourself, plenty of people that ask before trying anything because of scared of making mistakes.

Linux it appears has two directions to go, it can maintain it's very niche part in the desktop world or it can move onwards and claim a very large chunk of it. For some traditionalists, well they will want to stay in their own world but the people driving a lot of the distros appear to be making them more and more user friendly.

Linux desktop has already become some much more user friendly than it was 16 years ago. I personally don't care for more popularity of Linux desktop because it's already doing everything I need it do and what I want it do. However distributions will continue to evolve as will other technology and software. The only thing that will remain as is will be TempleOS

 

[MikeWalsh]

I think the OP is going to have problems with any Distro...especially claiming problems getting Mint to read data SSDs. View attachment 29576

Don't take this the wrong way, but "fanboi" behaviour - regardless of the distro in question - doesn't help any struggling newbie.

My view has always been the same. If you can't help - or are unable to offer assistance - it's best not to to post. Not just "jump on the bandwagon" 'cos the thread concerns your favourite distro / application / point of view and you feel you simply HAVE to add your two-penn'orth, regardless of whether it helps or not.

Isn't that what we do here? The "friendly" forum, where we do our very best to HELP anyone or everyone, regardless of their degree of commitment, ability and/or knowledge..?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~​

We're all guilty of this to a greater or lesser degree.....myself included. it's human nature, and tends to be more pronounced the more "chatty" & gregarious we are as an individual; in this respect, everybody's different. The issue frequently comes with those of us who've never learnt any kind of self-restraint....

Criticizing, finding fault or "making pronouncements" is not helpful to anyone. Like I said.....I'm as guilty of this as the next man, though I do usually manage to restrain myself. It's why I don't post here more than I do.....because there's a ton of stuff here I know I'm not even remotely qualified to help with, so why waste everybody's time?

If there's two things most folks develop as they age - disgracefully OR otherwise! - it's patience.....and restraint.

(shrug...)


Mike.

 

[tpkusr]

The good news is that I have managed to install and all the drives are visible and usable. But this is because I was advised to use Zorin rather than Mint. It may well be error on my part but the install in Zorin was far more simple and straightforward.
I do appreciate everyone's help here though.

The best part is you didn't give up. We have seen so many people just give up and go back to Windows. No matter which Linux you are using, you are now a member of the Linux family.

 

[CaffeineAddict]

The question is whether the Linux community want those people. Some seem to, many appear not to. I am sure some people inside think that they are pretty smart because they can do so many things with a Linux terminal that most people don't have a clue about.

Long time ago, from what I've heard, to be accepted you had to run a web server to prove yourself.

Today no such requirements exist, all it takes is willingness to become self sufficient at some point.

Do all you can not to become help vampire instead and you'll be just fine.

 

[Gareth]

Long time ago, from what I've heard, to be accepted you had to run a web server to prove yourself.

Today no such requirements exist, all it takes is willingness to become self sufficient at some point.

Do all you can not to become help vampire instead and you'll be just fine.

Hey, I am just telling you how it is to come to this forum and be helped by some of the good people here. And then get grief from some of the other "special ones". This is my experience. See the MODs step in because they are grown-ups.
And when I give a bit back, I am a vampire. There are few a people who obviously don't get out much, incel is an overused word, let's say they are challenged. I think someone mentioned fanbois.
I get it, you can see all these infidels coming over the horizon asking for help to get Linux up and running, your terminals are being gradually replaced by GUIs and the world you knew isn't the same. And I have some sympathy for you. But everything changes, whether we like it or not. The art is to move with the changes.
All I asked for was help. I found a solution and let you guys know and thanked those who tried to help me. Then I got grief. Really struggling to find how I offended a couple of people.

 

[f33dm3bits]

your terminals are being gradually replaced by GUIs and the world you knew isn't the same.

GUI's are not all bad and they are not being replaced by only GUI tools, they are still useful for power users otherwise Microsoft wouldn't have added powershell to Windows. Also as a tool to help people on forums as most of the time it's easiest get useful information from the terminal by telling someone what to run so that they can share the output rather than explaining where to click in a gui to find the information you need. As said in my other reply software keeps evolving, as will graphical tools on Linux, which will include what you can do with them, but graphical tools will never be replaced by only GUI's as you can script with GUI tools.

Most of the time telling someone to run a command is faster them the steps to take to get some information from a GUI and then place multiple screenshots. As for GUI tools from Desktop Enviroments(DE's) there are different tools and menu's and they are not all alike where you find things. Easier to get around with a terminal to help someone rather than having to search look where information X or Y is hidden in a graphical menu setting somewhere. For example menu's in Gnome, KDE Plasma and Cosmic are different and have different tools and setting names, etc.

In short terminal/command-line tools and graphical tools both have their place for different people and different tasks.

 

[f33dm3bits]

Do all you can not to become help vampire instead and you'll be just fine.

What @CaffeineAddict probably meant is don't treat forums as your own personal support desk, which you aren't as it has shown that you have taken the time to try out things yourself before asking a question.

 

[MzQ1NjExN2]

The only thing that will remain as is will be TempleOS

Amen to that.

 

[CaffeineAddict]

What @CaffeineAddict probably meant is don't treat forums as your own personal support desk, which you aren't as it has shown that you have taken the time to try out things yourself before asking a question.

I meant no offense, it was only advice.

And when I give a bit back, I am a vampire.

Didn't call anyone help vampire, I only said not to become one.

Please ignore what I said, I often give advices but find that people don't take them, you're not the first one, I guess I'll abstain from giving any advices in the future.

 

[Gareth]

I meant no offense, it was only advice.


Didn't call anyone help vampire, I only said not to become one.

Please ignore what I said, I often give advices but find that people don't take them, you're not the first one, I guess I'll abstain from giving any advices in the future.

All good

 

[Gareth]

I have to say there are very limited resources to issues that arise. Normally I get a problem, search engine it, find some decent resource and move on with it but Linux is limited versus Windows. Far less people, far fewer answers.