What A Difference A Kernel Makes.

[bob466]

I decided to install Mint Cinnamon 22.2 on my spare SSD for the fun of it...but it was anything but fun when I installed my Graphics Card Driver.

Mint comes with an open source driver and Kernel 6.14.0-35 which is only supported till Feb 2026 and causes problems...why not have a Kernel that's supported til 2029 and works.

You can't roll back this Kernel because it's the only one in advanced options...this is why I always wait 3 months so you can roll back if needed.

I had to install Kernel 6.8.0-87 to get my Graphics Card Driver to work...the strange thing is this Kernel is exactly the same one in Mint 22.1 and works just fine...I don't get it.

Someone I know has a new Tower with a brand new Graphics Card...I created an image of my system Mint Cinnamon 22.1 and put it on the Tower's SSD. Opened the Driver Manager and installed the Driver without any problems.

I would like to point out it's not only Mint that comes with this Kernel 6.14.0-35...another Ubuntu based Distro I install on my spare SSD did the same thing with the same result.

End of rant.

 

[Mike-BTU]

I decided to install Mint Cinnamon 22.2 on my spare SSD for the fun of it...but it was anything but fun when I installed my Graphics Card Driver.

What's your graphics card? I have a funny feeling that it's an older NVIDIA.

In the former Manjaro Telegram room, the majority of problem cards were NVIDIA.

 

[The Duck]

I gave up on using Nvidia graphics with Linux as the developers don't keep the older supported drivers and the Nvidia doesn't either.

Nvidia claims to support graphics cards for Linux although I don't see it unless you have a graphics card less than a few years old.

I believe the Linux developers could keep the older drivers working for new kernel releases and new distro releases they just don't want to.

I blame the hardware manufacturers and the distro developers.

I'm bout to stop my money donations to any opensource software project as it seems to not be going where and for what it needs to.

Like the song says "Are the good times really over and gone".

 

[KGIII]

I don't see it unless you have a graphics card less than a few years old.

That is more or less correct. The software support is the same for Windows as it is for Linux. It is NOT very long. They only support their (very expensive) graphics cards for six years.

Hardware & Software Support and Lifecycle

This FAQ document addresses common questions from vGPU customers, covering product offerings, releases, hardware and software lifecycles, ecosystem compatibility, proof of concept and sizing, licensing, deployment, and support options. It serves as a quick reference guide to provide clarity and...

docs.nvidia.com

They expect people to pay well into 4 figures (USD) for a graphics card that will only see official support for 6 years.

We Linux users upgrade more often, specifically to new major versions. Windows increments slowly. For example, Windows 10 was supported for 10 years. So, a graphics driver that's relatively old may still work just fine in Windows. In Linux, they stopped supporting that thing as soon as their agreements expired -- and we're supposed to feel grateful for that token nod.

I replace stuff fairly often and don't tend to bother with high-end graphics. So, I don't really know this to be true, but I have it on good authority that folks fare better with the open source drivers instead of trying to use the propreitary drivers. That's what I've read but I really don't have any experience to speak of.

Maybe I'll go with a fancy graphics card in my next system? I don't actually need one but I do a tiny bit of gaming. Hmm...

 

[dos2unix]

DistroWatch.com: Put the fun back into computing. Use Linux, BSD.

News and feature lists of Linux and BSD distributions.

distrowatch.com

Red Hat to distribute NVIDIA CUDA across Red Hat AI, RHEL and OpenShift

Red Hat teams up with NVIDIA to distribute the NVIDIA CUDA Toolkit directly within its leading open source platforms, helping developers access the essential tools they need for GPU-accelerated computing from a single, trusted source.

www.redhat.com

A little easier for Fedora/Redhat users as now Nividia drivers are included in the vendor repos.
If you're a Fedora developer you get access to newer drivers than are on Nvidias webiste.

 

[The Duck]

We Linux users upgrade more often, specifically to new major versions. Windows increments slowly. For example, Windows 10 was supported for 10 years. So, a graphics driver that's relatively old may still work just fine in Windows. In Linux, they stopped supporting that thing as soon as their agreements expired -- and we're supposed to feel grateful for that token nod.

This is probably why I have acquired the poor attitude I have about certain graphics hardware and Linux.

I used Windows XP from the day it came out and never had a hardware driver issue for the entire life Windows XP.

I still use Windows XP offline to run Flight Simulators.

I can still download from Nvidia website any of the drivers I need for any of the graphics cards I have.

We Linux users upgrade more often, specifically to new major versions. Windows increments slowly. For example, Windows 10 was supported for 10 years. So, a graphics driver that's relatively old may still work just fine in Windows. In Linux, they stopped supporting that thing as soon as their agreements expired -- and we're supposed to feel grateful for that token nod.

I replace stuff fairly often and don't tend to bother with high-end graphics. So, I don't really know this to be true, but I have it on good authority that folks fare better with the open source drivers instead of trying to use the propreitary drivers. That's what I've read but I really don't have any experience to speak of.

If you are a heavy gamer and I don't mean board games opensource Linux graphics drivers suck.

True real gaming requires a real graphics card with a real oem proprietary graphics diver.

Linux opensource drivers offer very few features if any at all.
No CCC from Linux if you have a AMD / ATI Radeon graphics card.

Nvidia does offer a control center / control panel doesn't really do anything you can't already do using the default display panel.

That may have changed but I doubt it.

That's what I've read but I really don't have any experience to speak of.

Opensource graphics drivers have improved a great deal over the years I've used Linux.

Opensource graphics drivers don't compare to oem proprietary graphics drivers when it come to high end gaming.

When I tried Linux Flight Gear Flight Simulator using opensource graphics drivers it wouldn't even run it would start and then freeze.

Maybe I'll go with a fancy graphics card in my next system? I don't actually need one but I do a tiny bit of gaming. Hmm...

I'm just going to use Linux for what it's for which is the WWW which as it is OOTB works very well.

The type of gaming I do doesn't work well using Linux due to lack of graphics drivers.
I refuse to have to replace a graphics card every couple of years.

When it comes to real hard core gaming Windows rules and always will rule.

I know hardcore gamers who would rent their wives and kids out for gaming and they all use Windows OS.

 

[KGIII]

True real gaming requires a real graphics card with a real oem proprietary graphics diver.

Pretty much...

There are some Linux gamers, but they're limited on what they can play. For example, there's a ton of modern games that won't work because of 'anti-cheat' features.

Are We Anti-Cheat Yet?

areweanticheatyet.com

If that site is to be believed, and I think that it can be, games with anti-cheat are darned near a no-go on Linux. Only some 17% are fully supported, with more than half of them being completely broken.

And that's just anti-cheat issues.

You have WINE, Proton, Bottles, etc... But not even those will let you play all of the games. Performance suffers in a VM, so that too isn't always an option.

We Linux users are 2nd class citizens, at best.

In fact, in the US, about 11% of the people are below the poverty line.

On a good day, pundits claim that Linux has 5% of the desktop market.

We're very much a minority. 64% of us wear corrective lenses. 90% of adults in the US have experienced dental decay.

Do you know what we're close to? Vegetarians. In the US, 4% to 6% of the population is vegetarian.

 

[The Duck]

There are some Linux gamers, but they're limited on what they can play. For example, there's a ton of modern games that won't work because of 'anti-cheat' features.

Are We Anti-Cheat Yet?

areweanticheatyet.com

If that site is to be believed, and I think that it can be, games with anti-cheat are darned near a no-go on Linux. Only some 17% are fully supported, with more than half of them being completely broken.

And that's just anti-cheat issues.

You have WINE, Proton, Bottles, etc... But not even those will let you play all of the games. Performance suffers in a VM, so that too isn't always an option.

We Linux users are 2nd class citizens, at best.

Exactly why Windows will always rule when it comes to hardcore real gaming.

 

[The Duck]

Hopefully this ain't off topic.

How to Install the Original Kernel 6.8 in Ubuntu 24.04 LTS | UbuntuHandbook

 

[theLegionWithin]

Maybe I'll go with a fancy graphics card in my next system? I don't actually need one but I do a tiny bit of gaming. Hmm...

in my most recent upgrade, I switched over to amd hardware (integrated gpu) and have yet to run into something I cant play - though I dont play many games. recently started playing Beyond All Reason (though I suck at it )

 

[bob466]

I'm amazed at the lack of knowledge people have when it comes to Linux kernels especially the latest one 6.14.0-35 shipped with the newest version of Mint 22.2.

common Issues with Linux Kernel 6.14.35

Boot Problems​

• Users have reported that kernel 6.14.0-33-generic fails to boot on some systems, particularly with NVMe devices not being detected. Previous versions like 6.14.0-32 work without issues.​

NVIDIA Driver Incompatibilities​

• Many users upgrading to kernel 6.14 have experienced problems with NVIDIA graphics cards. Issues include driver incompatibilities, compilation failures, and system instability. Some users reverted to older kernels to resolve these issues.​

Missing Packages​

• The absence of essential packages, such as linux-modules-extra-6.14.0-27-generic, has been noted. Installing this package can resolve various driver-related problems.​

System Freezes and Peripheral Failures​

• Reports indicate that kernel 6.14.0-33-generic causes system freezes and makes peripherals unavailable. Users have had to boot into older kernel versions to regain functionality.​

There's a simple fix for those with a little knowledge...as they say..."a little knowledge goes a long way".

 

[Condobloke]

The link from @The Duck is from the Ubuntu handbook, and covers the steps nicely......a bit complex for my tastes, but accurate.
I prefer Linux Mint's approach, which can all be done from the Update Manager/View/Kernels.

I also note that ubuntu Handbook advocates the use of Grub-Customizer. The last I heard grub customizer was under a cloud for misbehaviour. It would be of interest to know if that situation has been rectified.
The last time I used it (some years ago.....but since 2019) it ruined my install, and exhibited very nasty tendencies !
I swore black and blue I would never use it again.

 

[The Duck]

I did all of mine within the terminal and never touched grub.

It offers two options.

I used option 1.

sudo apt install linux-image-generic

sudo apt remove --autoremove linux-generic-hwe-24.04 linux-image-6.14.0-27-generic linux-headers-6.14.0-27-generic linux-modules-6.14.0-27-generic

Two commands entered separately then a couple of reboots and all is well.

 

[The Duck]

I'm amazed at the lack of knowledge people have when it comes to Linux kernels especially the latest one 6.14.0-35 shipped with the newest version of Mint 22.2. View attachment 28582

common Issues with Linux Kernel 6.14.35

Boot Problems​

• Users have reported that kernel 6.14.0-33-generic fails to boot on some systems, particularly with NVMe devices not being detected. Previous versions like 6.14.0-32 work without issues.​

NVIDIA Driver Incompatibilities​

• Many users upgrading to kernel 6.14 have experienced problems with NVIDIA graphics cards. Issues include driver incompatibilities, compilation failures, and system instability. Some users reverted to older kernels to resolve these issues.​

Missing Packages​

• The absence of essential packages, such as linux-modules-extra-6.14.0-27-generic, has been noted. Installing this package can resolve various driver-related problems.​

System Freezes and Peripheral Failures​

• Reports indicate that kernel 6.14.0-33-generic causes system freezes and makes peripherals unavailable. Users have had to boot into older kernel versions to regain functionality.​

There's a simple fix for those with a little knowledge...as they say..."a little knowledge goes a long way". View attachment 28583

Some people fail to do any kind of investigation prior to installing and then wonder why they have issues.

I've been guilty in the past my own self.

Been there done that.

Learn by doing.

 

[KGIII]

and have yet to run into something I cant play

That's just by your choice, which is not a bad thing. There are many titles that can't be played on Linux, regardless of your GPU.

The most annoying is, to me, the anti-cheat stuff. While a small subset of those work on Linux, well over half of them do not, and even more don't work entirely properly.

I get the whole 'anti-cheat' thing. Cheaters suck, unless you're playing by yourself (or everybody agrees to cheat).

A part of that anti-cheat thing might be an 'us' thing. From what I understand, it'd have to involve some code in the kernel.

We will not be sticking unknown binary blobs into the kernel itself. I mean, we theoretically could. We're just opposed to the very idea of that. While security by obscurity isn't always a good thing, I'm not sure how well anti-cheat mechanisms would work if they were open source. That's outside of my wheelhouse.

But, yeah... You're getting those results based on the games you choose to play. There are a ton of games verified to not work on Linux. You can check the Proton database, for starters.

What sort of cracks me up is that the Steam Deck is based on Linux. The Steam Deck can't play the entire Steam library because of this. (There are some up-and-coming mobile devices that run Windows and Steam. Their prices are more than I'd care to pay for a device I'd seldom use.)

 

[The Duck]

(There are some up-and-coming mobile devices that run Windows and Steam. Their prices are more than I'd care to pay for a device I'd seldom use.)

Yep that's where I'm at now my Flight Simulator towers are old and the graphics cards no longer live.

Time to build a new tower other than I don't want to spend that kind of cash.

I'm running Flight Simulator X on a tower with an APU it's okay but it ain't as good.

Maybe one day before I pass on to my next life.

 

[KGIII]

Time to build a new tower other than I don't want to spend that kind of cash.

Maybe pick up a refurbished device and then upgrade the graphics card with a used example? You won't need bleeding edge for that flight sim game, I don't think. You can scour your local marketplaces. Facebook is not a great site, but they do have a great marketplace for stuff like that.

 

[Mike-BTU]

I switched over to amd hardware (integrated gpu)

There's a lot to be said for integrated graphics in lieu of a plug-in card! Never had an issue with Intel integrated graphics either.

 

[Kojack]

I am looking at getting a lenovo laptop from 2022 to replace my 2021 Dell that pooped the bed yesterday. I do content creation, graphics, photography, videography and podcast work on this device. It has a t1200 nvidia graphics card, Will this work in Zorin 18? I do not game at all just creative workflows.

 

[MikeWalsh]

Some people fail to do any kind of investigation prior to installing and then wonder why they have issues.

Learn by doing.

^^^ +1.

Our archivist, Ally, has copies of every kernel ever built for Puppy. From the mid-3 series, up to and including the very latest 6-series, they're in 'modular' format, too.....with the zdrv containing the kernel modules. You swap the 'vmlinuz' and the corresponding zdrv over, and re-name the zdrv.....and you can run ANY kernel that takes your fancy.

Many of us do this manually, though we do have a Puppy-native GUI that will do this for you.


Mike.