Distro Candidates: MX vs. AntiX, which is best for the following purpose?

HAL_2000

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"I don't believe that Windows XP window manager is an option that is offered in LXLE.

"Making a Linux distro look like Windows XP won't make it any easier to learn to use it's still Linux underneath.

"I never will understand why everyone wants Linux to look like Windows. "

See this is a very common sentiment expressed in various Linux fora. Perhaps it's from my current and prior professions that made you have to step outside yourself and play the opposite side of the chessboard which make it easier to understand the point of view of others.

Currently the market share of Windows OS is about 88 % versus Linux in all its permutations is a little under 2 % for the US desktop / laptop market. Keep in mind that *my* particular users have always used Windows and not Linux. Windows is familiar to them. Based on experience, you have very little time from the time they hit the power switch until the time the user determines whether the machine is too alien, or too slow, or is otherwise not good. Keep in mind that these are donations, but I will assume that the short attention span evaluation of the average user, perusing sales models on display in a big box store, isn't much longer.

The Windows icons, start button, task bar and how the drill down menus work are *familiar.* Being a user of Linux, you might have missed the howls of dismay by XP users when VISTA took so long even to boot up or go from one operation to the next. Or the rage echoing through social media when Win 8 got rid of the START button and essentially rearranged the furniture in Helen Keller's living room, after she had finally memorized the location of everything through years of experience.

You start with a familiar face. No jarring and alien initial look and the process of getting used to how Linux works (within reason) can then proceed apace.

If the process includes having to become a Terminal Command expert, I can tell you right now, that 1.89 percent market share will not budge and the user will go back to expensive, buggy and bloated Windows, because it is familiar.

It's important to Windows users. Those are the people, and it is their sensibilities that I am trying to address.

 

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Currently the market share of Windows OS is about 88 % versus Linux in all its permutations is a little under 2 % for the US desktop / laptop market.
I'm aware of the market share between Linux and Windows although don't care.
Yes I use Linux although I don't want Linux to become the home user base choice.
If Linux does become the home user base choice than it will become just as polluted as Windows.

Being a user of Linux, you might have missed the howls of dismay by XP users when VISTA took so long even to boot up or go from one operation to the next. Or the rage echoing through social media when Win 8 got rid of the START button
You're assuming people who use Linux have always used Linux.
I remember Windows XP and Windows Vista and never had any problems with either.

The problem users had with Windows Vista being slow was because they installed it on computers designed to run Windows XP and not designed to run Windows Vista,

I still use Windows XP computers to run my Flight Simulators on although I keep them offline as Windows XP has reached EOL and is no longer supported.

I'm a Linux user and a Windows 10 user and very familiar with the user base market share between Windows and Linux and other OSs.

You start with a familiar face. No jarring and alien initial look and the process of getting used to how Linux works (within reason) can then proceed apace.

If the process includes having to become a Terminal Command expert, I can tell you right now, that 1.89 percent market share will not budge and the user will go back to expensive, buggy and bloated Windows, because it is familiar.

It's important to Windows users. Those are the people, and it is their sensibilities that I am trying to address.
I personally could care less what OS anyone uses.

Use what OS you're most familiar with and most comfortable using.

I can use all of them without any problems as an OS is an OS and one OS is no better than another OS as they all work.

Most users who have migrated from Windows to Linux and go back to Windows do so for several different reasons.

The main reason is that most people are lazy and don't want to learn a new OS because Windows is what they've used their whole life.

Most users don't care how haphazardly their computer systems work as long as they can face book and do other social media.

Bottom line is I use Linux because I can and I like it and prefer it to Windows 10.

I have Windows 10 because the Windows 10 upgrade is free and you can't complain about free.

I use to refurbish computers and install Linux on them however people don't want Linux people want Windows 10.

I can't give Linux computers away however I can sell as many Windows 10 laptops as I can come up with.

Plain and simple people like Windows and that my friend ain't going to change anytime soon.
 
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sp331yi

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OP hasn't finished exploring the options, but wants an easy, windows-like distro
Don't like it myself, but OP may -- robolinux
Specs for inidividual machines would be helpful, but apparently a one-size-fits-all is what it desired.
No can do, in most cases, OP.
 

HAL_2000

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Thanks sp331yi. I'll look into it. The Wiz suggested eLive the other day. So now I have AntiX, MX, eLive and Robo to look at.

And you are exactly right. I am looking for a Windows up front, Linux running in the Background distro. I really do think that's the magic combination for mass adoption of Linux. Think of it as the gateway drug that may introduce some of those users to more conventional distros of Linux.

Poorguy, my friend, I think ultimately you understand that it's not about you. It's not even about me. It's about finding a form of Linux that revives older hardware (and there is well over a half dozen distros specifically coded for that purpose ) and yet presents a familiar face to the masses of Windows users whom we have to grudgingly accept the fact that they have no particular interest in HOW software works. They just want to use it for their personal purpose.

These are my target audience, and getting well working machines to them is my mission. I've been doing that as a hobby for some years now. The payoff is a smile of delight as they start playing with a computer that works.

One example : I had made a machine for the mother of a special needs kid. I chanced meeting her six months later as we were filling up our gas tanks. She had a big smile for me as she said: "he LOVES Matchbox Racing!" (one of the games I installed on his machine.)

It's all for them. But, if we can get a broadly accepted form of Linux out to the public, it'll be for us too.

Peace, brother.
 

HAL_2000

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It took a forum rant, but I have managed to get a response from the good people at Q4OS.


I've told as many who might listen that I *really* like their install, but for their lack of hardware recognition and automatic driver install (the kind you see in lightweight distros based on Ubuntu), which is a real deal killer.

Q4OS says that it wants to be considered as a business operating system and I kinda called them on it:

Q4OS .. Please Call Your Office, meaning -- people are posting to your forum, but no one is ANSWERING. https://www.q4os.org/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=17951

Well the interesting part of what Q4OS has been doing in the background is that they are thinking of making a Ubuntu-based ('fork?') and ever more better-er, one offering a lightweight TRINITY DE.

Since they have even solicited code-names for their new release, I've put my 2 cents in for the codename of QUEST.
 
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wizardfromoz

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That would be very nice to hear about. Can you ask him please? Thank you.
Darren has been notified with my mention, and notified again by you :):)

When you type a person's username with an @ in front, it notifies them they are being mentioned, both in their alerts when they are logged in or next log in, and via their email, if they have their Account preferences set up appropriately.

If yours are set up accordingly, you will get an alert from me from the following.

There is an autocomplete function as well, case-insensitive, so if I type

hal with an ampersand, I get this, after choosing

@HAL_2000



SCREENSHOT 1

Screenshot 1 method saves you with weird mixed case user-id's, or long ones.

If you travel the forums, you will see this protocol used frequently.




SCREENSHOT 2

This one saves on a lot of "Wiz wrote" 's, and also attributes the author of the selected text, and where it was written.

eg

And yet I have not yet had any experience with ROX, other than a brief sortie into Puppy Linux. One of my friends here, Darren @darry1966 , a New Zealander, is well-versed in Puppy, so he may have some input on ROX.
Cheers

Wizard
 

HAL_2000

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@wizardfromoz, @darry1966

Ha. So *that's* why you shouldn't even say the name Voldemort.

I look forward to hearing about if and how ROX can be integrated as a DE in Q4OS.

Some specific questions I have for him.

1) If Q4OS comes with Trinity and works well with the install, but I load ROX as a DE instead, can or should I uninstall any heavier, more RAM-intensive DE's from the install?

2) Where does ROX exist on the spectrum of Desktop Environments, insofar as RAM use is concerned? [see attachment of DE footprints]

3) Lastly, would ROX be able to coexist with this XP theme installer?

XPQ4 - Windows look'n feel for your Q4OS desktop

I suppose what I am searching for is an install that is tailor made for this specific use *, which also has real-world application for a LOT of potential Windows-to-Linux converts. I'm hoping they actually roll that distro out and call it QUEST.
* https://www.q4os.org/forum/viewtopic.php?pid=17951#p17951

That would absolutely rock.

Of course, some of these questions might strike an experienced Linux user as nonsense.

I am not an experienced Linux user, but a new *potential* convert.
 

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darry1966

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Rox has a very low footprint because it still uses gtk2, As for integration - there are distros which easily allow you to use rox pinboard such as antix. You should be able to play with any distro and make Rox-filer the default.
 

HAL_2000

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Thanks darry1966.

Now, considering that any potential Windows convert has little experience in implementing what you've described (much less familiarity with terms such as "pinboard"), do you have a previous post or webpage URL you could direct the curious to, with instructions, such as terminal commands, in taking an OOTB distro and making ROX the default DE?

Thanks in advance.
 

Tolkem

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If Linux can release a distro with those users in mind, it can seize a substantial chunk of market share from Microsoft, and perhaps even Apple/Mac.
Most modern distros do offer their own set of unique tools to make the user's computing experience a trouble free one as far as possible, if you tried Linux Lite you might have noticed that it ships with some of those as well as Q4OS, antiX and MX do too.

taking an OOTB distro and making ROX the default DE?
ROX is the default DE for antiX, so your best bet is try that one.
 

HAL_2000

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I did try Linux Lite and thought it quite good, but if I recall correctly, they've ceased support for 32-bit architecture and you have to reach back a bit and download an older distro which does.

Indeed, a lot of developers are ceasing support of 32 bit architecture boards. I suppose that even though many of them publish distros specifically designed to revive older machines (both laptops and conventional boards), the 32 bit is *too* old and should be phased out.

I have a substantial inventory of 32 bit machines which I am trying to convert into useful, working basic machines. How old is too old I guage by a functions test and burn-in period. If it can reliably and easily stream online music and video, play and record CDs or DVDs and move pageviews quickly within an application, it likely has about 3 years of hard use left in it under or on some kids desk.

I've run into old donations that have been kept beyond that timeframe, but I figure 3 years is a rough ballpark. Each harddrive, even before loading an OS onto it, is SMART tested to make sure it has some life left in it.

Once I can select the aspect of this inventory that'll work with whichever distro I deem the best candidate, the rest will be retired for reclamation, and I may even get out of the refurbishing / re-gifting business altogether, and take up something else, like MMA karate.
 

Tolkem

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I did try Linux Lite and thought it quite good, but if I recall correctly, they've ceased support for 32-bit architecture and you have to reach back a bit and download an older distro which does.
Yes, indeed it has. Last one which supported 32 is 3.8 which runs quite good and has some few months of supoort since it's based on Ubuntu 16.04, however, xenial does have extended support up to 2024 https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Releases so maybe you could use Linux Lite 3.8 https://sourceforge.net/projects/linuxlite/files/3.8/ There is Bodhi Linux too https://www.bodhilinux.com/download/ when downloading choose the legacy .iso which is 32bit. and according to their site
Legacy –
This is our 32bit release. The Legacy 5.1 image utilizes the older 4.9.0-6-686 Linux kernel that is optimized for old (15+ years old) hardware. This kernel also does not include the PAE extension which is not supported on many older systems.
So you might give this one a try; It's Ubuntu based and as you mentioned that one recognizes all the hardware.
 
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From the above link.

Good advice imo. (ahem) apparently someone can't handle criticism. :p:D

I wonder hmm surely not. :rolleyes:


lxle March 27


I think making them look like windows boxes is actually a disservice to the user. It gives the user the impression that they're going to act like windows. Things will work the same and they should expect the same things from them. Which actually leads to more user frustration when the Linux box doesn't behave like windows because it's linux.
 
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HAL_2000

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Poorguy, it's not about you. It's not your machine that will have an XP themed install. It's a young kid, or an old lady, or some recovering vet.

Oddly enough, to some, the very thought that someone, somewhere, has a machine running Linux with a Windows themed start button, task bar and icons causes them physical pain.

Tsk.
 

HAL_2000

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Yes, indeed it has. Last one which supported 32 is 3.8 which runs quite good and has some few months of supoort since it's based on Ubuntu 16.04, however, xenial does have extended support up to 2024 https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Releases so maybe you could use Linux Lite 3.8 https://sourceforge.net/projects/linuxlite/files/3.8/ There is Bodhi Linux too https://www.bodhilinux.com/download/ when downloading choose the legacy .iso which is 32bit. and according to their site


So you might give this one a try; It's Ubuntu based and as you mentioned that one recognizes all the hardware.
Thanks Tolkem.

Looks like I'm going to have a series of different Linux ISO's on a boot USB. Normally I can fit a few on a single flash drive using the YUMI installer, but YUMI doesn't digest all installs very well, so if you can recommend a multiboot USB installer that can accommodate eLive, Bohdi, AntiX, MX, RoboLinux and the ones you mentioned, I'd greatly appreciate it.

TIA
 
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Oddly enough, to some, the very thought that someone, somewhere, has a machine running Linux with a Windows themed start button, task bar and icons causes them physical pain.
OH Brother. :rolleyes: What a load of crap. :D
 

wizardfromoz

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MultibootUSB, HAL - http://multibootusb.org/ ... is worth a shot, I have used it with some success when I had Windozey 10 on this rig. Have a read of the features, guide and perhaps FAQ on the front page.

Tom and HAL - if its pistols at 10 paces, I get to clean up the mess, so get over it and move on.

:)
 

wizardfromoz

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Hey Green Hornet, we almost crossed beams - that can be dangerous :)
 

darry1966

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Regarding the earlier Pinboard question: the meaning relates to icons showing on an Antix or Puppy Linux desktop. This where a fully implemented desktop is not present. Examples Icewm and JWM.

There is an option in to turn pinboard on and off which is controlled by Rox-Filer.

Advantages are on= 1 click shortcuts to apps. Avantage off=clean uncluttered desktop.

Antix makes it easy by having the option to turn on or off the pinboard.

Further reading: http://rox.sourceforge.net/desktop/taxonomy/term/15.html
 


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