Real World Issues Switching to Mint?

[Vaj2]

Hi all. I’ve been researching the possibility of switching to Linux and registered on the forum yesterday.

MS abuse of the power of the Windows platform has reached intolerable levels so it's time to act. Linux seems meanwhile to be the valid alternative that restores control of the desktop to the user. It’s hard to conclude other than that cloud computing was a Trojan horse designed to end users’ control of their own computers…

The tutorials suggest that Linux Mint with Cinnamon desktop may be a good choice for personal use by a retired engineer that’s a user rather than an IT specialist. The helpful and enthusiastic mindset of the Linux community has proven refreshing. Likewise the clean and functional Mint/Cinnamon interface.

I hope this is not overdoing it, but some feedback regarding the real-world issues likely to arise in respect of the fairly basic (?) requirements listed below (matters that might arise to make the transition less than trouble-free) would be appreciated. Also to help to identify what in the list is not built into or is sketchy/best substituted in the Mint suite

There's no problem within reason with taking the time necessary to become familiar with Linux, but an ongoing requirement to de-bug stuff, make heavy use of command lines (my memory is not what it was) and find work arounds to e.g. get devices and apps working would not be so good.

Against that my inclination if it looks feasible is to go for broke – to remove Windows and install Mint in its place. (there’s nothing like having to do it to get a job done)

The computer is a fairly old (2016) but of decent spec at the time Asus UX501 VW Zen Book Pro (UK/Irish/EU model) laptop with an Intel Core i7-6700HQ 2.6 GHz CPU, 12 GB of RAM and a 475GB hard drive. (316GB currently free with 64 bit Win 10 Prof installed) The display from the spec seems to be (?) NVIDIA Ge Force GTX 960M 3840x2860x59Hz and Intel HD graphics 530 - I'm not sure what the numbers refer to.

Requirements in no particular order include:

• Reliability of function.
• Security – reliable and scam resistant, especially in the context of access to bank accounts, passwords (is this sort of information saved/protected in Mint?) and when ordering from ecommerce sites like Amazon, Ebay and independent businesses.
• Little or no unrequested use of pushy 'help' and/or selling pop ups.
• Settings stay put unless they are changed by the user.
• Free and unrestricted access to all normal commercial and other international websites.
• Reliable and straightforward transfer of existing user files and data to the new apps – mostly Titan emails, File Explorer folders and docts., contacts, bookmarks.
• Reliable exchange of documents, files etc with websites and users of Windows, Mac OS etc computers.
• Compatibility with a Teltonika 4G router based hard wired CAT6A home network.
• Compatibility with current mouse, keyboard, hub, switch, headphones etc.
• Email – doesn’t have to be fancy but should allow word processor level document formatting. (currently using Titan Mail)
• Office suite apps of decent quality – as above.
• Good search engine capability - hopefully including means to avoid Google’s disregard of search terms in favour of presenting one half page listing of vaguely relevant highest bidders.
• Browsing free of interference – including uncensored access to international sites reporting matters of geopolitical interest, acceptability to bank security systems etc.
• Printing to/scanning from a Canon GX2050 three in one.
• Reliable data backup – at least to local hard drive(s). Are cloud based options possible without walking back into the clutches of big tech?
• Safe (malware and bug free) access to basic everyday apps. such as maps etc.
• Basic photo, drawing and graphics manipulation. (not professional level)
• VPN
• Access to YouTube (advert free – currently achieving this using Brave) and similar streaming sites.
• The ability to make low-cost web phone calls would be nice but is not essential.
• The ability to open and read CAD files would be nice but is not essential.
• Gaming is not required.

A related matter is that of finding a similar mobile phone solution - the pushy infestation of a recently bought smart phone by Google is similarly unacceptable. Thoughts on this matter would also be appreciated.

Does there exist a practical means of stepping free of their tentacles short of going back to a basic phone?

Thanks…

 

[Condobloke]

The tutorials suggest that Linux Mint with Cinnamon desktop may be a good choice for personal use

Amen to the above ^^^^

To answer you below, I have increased my font size, so my ramblings will stand out ....

• Reliability of function.

Reliability is LM's (Linux Mints) middle name. Rock solid

• Security – reliable and scam resistant, especially in the context of access to bank accounts, passwords (is this sort of information saved/protected in Mint?) and when ordering from ecommerce sites like Amazon, Ebay and independent businesses.

Security, as in AV's are not necessary. The Linux system is built to be secure. A well set up browser is mandatory. Good browsing habits as well. I access bank accounts and the like quite freely. I use a Password Manager....but NOT for bank accounts. I use Bitwarden. If I was subject to a bit of paranoia (whi I am not) i would likely employ the vpn I use when I access bank accounts and the like.
The most common form of intrusion into any OS is via a nasty email....usually containing a link to further nastiness. Think before you click.

• Little or no unrequested use of pushy 'help' and/or selling pop ups.

Again, the browser. Every man and his dog will have a differing opinion on "what's best"...but at the end of most days the bloke or girl sitting in the chair thumping the keys is the culprit. I use brave browser, and I use the settings there to avoid google like the plague. It is successful because they regularly inform me that I have all cookies for them disabled. I call that a win. There are also many sites that guide you through roping googles intrusiveness down....obviously that has worked as well.
I honestly do not know of a bad browser.

• Settings stay put unless they are changed by the user.

You can count on it. In the update manager it is possible to set the updates to download and install automatically when they are available. That is the ONLY time I know of that this sort of thing can occur.
I dont use it. I DO install EVERY update that is there....but I do it manually. Click on update manager in the system tray (near the clock) and click on install...fill in the password....sit back and yawn....or drink coffee....or continue with 'work'....or have a beer....there is no need to stop....the updates will 'do their thing'
The only time you will need to reboot sometime after is when a new kernel has been downloaded....the timing of that reboot is up to YOU. Linux will not do the windows thing and close you down.

• Free and unrestricted access to all normal commercial and other international websites.

Yes. The only time this can be restricted will only depend on perhapos some setting in a browser (rare) or maybe a dns setting (rare) or perhaps a firewall rule (again rare.....when you install Linux Mint be sure to enable the firewall. More about that later. The firewall is like a condom....dont leave home without it...)

• Reliable and straightforward transfer of existing user files and data to the new apps – mostly Titan emails, File Explorer folders and docts., contacts, bookmarks.

Now you have opened murky territory. What are Titan emails?....I cannot see that Titan can be run in Linux. It is likely possible that Titan cn be opened via Thunderbird.
""Thunderbird is a full-featured email, RSS and newsgroup client that makes emailing safer, faster and easier than ever before. It supports different mail accounts (POP, IMAP, Gmail), has a simple mail account setup wizard, one- click address book, tabbed interface, an integrated learning spam filter, advanced search and indexing capabilities, and offers easy organization of mails with tagging and virtual folders. It also features unrivalled extensibility.""
Anything that is predominantly windows will not open in Linux....I am talking about proprietary apps....file explorer folders may transfer across, depending on their file type.....I am a little unsure here....it is a LOT of years since I have so much as breathed anywhere near a window pc.
Contact....email contacts are usually saved as a zip file and will always be exported/imported by Thunderbird
Bookmarks....I have zero idea....I do not use them.....someone will no doubt fill in here
Which browser do you currently use ?... if Firefox, they should transfer via your Firefox account.

• Reliable exchange of documents, files etc with websites and users of Windows, Mac OS etc computers.

Websites etc are of course the same the world over.
documents and files depend solely on the file type.....put thta info and someone with expertise in that area can tell you ....likely @osprey (that is a members name who will likely have the knowledge....no need for you to do anything...he will receive a notification)

• Compatibility with a Teltonika 4G router based hard wired CAT6A home network.

Again, @osprey will likely know....if not there are others who will
Also @GatorsFan

• Compatibility with current mouse, keyboard, hub, switch, headphones etc.

Later....life calls

• Email – doesn’t have to be fancy but should allow word processor level document formatting. (currently using Titan Mail)
• Office suite apps of decent quality – as above.
• Good search engine capability - hopefully including means to avoid Google’s disregard of search terms in favour of presenting one half page listing of vaguely relevant highest bidders.
• Browsing free of interference – including uncensored access to international sites reporting matters of geopolitical interest, acceptability to bank security systems etc.
• Printing to/scanning from a Canon GX2050 three in one.
• Reliable data backup – at least to local hard drive(s). Are cloud based options possible without walking back into the clutches of big tech?
• Safe (malware and bug free) access to basic everyday apps. such as maps etc.
• Basic photo, drawing and graphics manipulation. (not professional level)
• VPN
• Access to YouTube (advert free – currently achieving this using Brave) and similar streaming sites.
• The ability to make low-cost web phone calls would be nice but is not essential.
• The ability to open and read CAD files would be nice but is not essential.
• Gaming is not required.

 

[osprey]

It looks like nearly all of the requirements can be met, and mostly exceed expectations. It's easier to point to what's a bit less robust. That said, one might mention that there is a lot to learn in using a linux installation for the new user which takes time. In that respect, one might imagine the time it took to learn how to run an MS installaton, and factor that into one's expectations.

Here are some observations.

@Vaj2 wrote:

heavy use of command lines (my memory is not what it was) and find work arounds to e.g. get devices and apps working would not be so good.

In the first instance, the GUI will almost certainly be available for a totally functional interaction with programs or apps so there would be no need for command line commands. In relation to remembering commands, if one gets into them, one doesn't have to remember their details since each has a manual page on the system that the user can access to refresh memory if they need to. It's all supplied.

On the "exchange of documents" with Windows, whilst there is no issue with the exchanging process, it would however, be wise to install a virus or malware checker so that the machine doesn't pass on malware infected files to other machines. The Windows malware itself cannot disturb the linux operating system, but it's the recipients of bad files that maybe at risk.

In relation to the printer, there is support for the Canon GX2050 three in one. The support is through a number of packages: gutenprint, sane and cups. Canon is not known for supplying many linux drivers, but their website is worth a look in case they have something new. It can be fiddly configuring printers, and sometimes the linux software doesn't take full advantage of all the capabilities of the printer, but basic functionality is generally fine.

Although there is no linux version of AutoCAD, linux programs can open CAD files using the standard CAD file formats, and has a CAD universe of its own. For example, check here:

How to Open .dwg Format in Ubuntu | Baeldung on Linux

Learn about various programs that can be used to open .dwg files on Ubuntu.

www.baeldung.com

The details discussed are relevant to linux installations beyond the ubuntu used as an example since the applications discussed are installable in each.

In relation to the router, there is no problem. Linux networking is an industry standard and it covers all the relevant networking protocols and software implementations needed to run standard networking hardware like this router. Since you mention a wired connection to the router, the issues that linux sometimes has with some wifi will be absent.

On the matter of "low-cost web phone calls", I can't say. There's a forum thread on the subject here:

https://www.linux.org/threads/make-a-phone-call-from-desktop.49132/

On another forum, a discussion here:

how to make phone calls over wifi? - Linux Mint Forums

 

[Brickwizard]

The computer is a fairly old (2016)

not compared to my laptop [and many others in use by members] it may be a little mature but is excellent for using Linux

I will list below some of the more newbie friendly distributions. But i will not kid you , whichever you choose you will be on a learning curve,,
Mint LMDE
Mint 21.3
MX-linux
Parrot home
Linux Lite
Ubuntu
notes
I recommend at this stage Mint 21.3 over the newer version as this is a stable release
Linux Lite is a a little more basic than the rest
MX is designed predominantly for office use so has a leaning towards slightly better user security
Parrot home, is the everyday edition of the Parrot security pen-testing [hacking] distribution so again the applications included lean towards better user security

 

[Egzoset]

Whatever you choose the slogan « Fix once, Break many » will eventually verify. YMMV, have a Plan-B ready!

 

[darry1966]

Welcome aboard the forums. With any operating system there is a learning curve. The Journey is worth it. Use Linux daily as in Debian at the moment. My laptop probably same vintage and Linux loves it.

Have a great journey .

 

[Brickwizard]

hard wired CAT6A home network.

MY home network is a mix of Cat 5E [full copper] and cat 6 [full copper] Ethernet connection to the router is not a problem as they all use the same standards. [its wi-fi that can cause problems on Linux]

 

[kc1di]

Hello @Vaj2
Welcome to the Linux.org forum, enjoy the journey!
Can't add much to the discussion, been using Linux since 1993 or so and have found it to be a great OS. Of course the distro that you choose will depend a great deal on your hardware, Work load and personal taste. This page may help you on your way.

Home | Linux Journey

linuxjourney.com

Mint is a good choice for new user. It's solid and has good hardware compatibility.
Good luck with whatever you choose and let us know how you get on.

 

[CaffeineAddict]

Welcome to forums, and to Linux!

 

[Vaj2]

Thank you for the feedback and information sources guys - you went to a lot of trouble to respond properly. It's much appreciated - there's lots of important pointers in there.

It sounds as though the Mint/Cinnamon route is both feasible and probably as good a Linux option as is available in our situation.

Next up is some detailed research into the specific topics - that will no doubt throw up more questions.

How do you feel about the possibility of going for a fresh/Windows removing install of Mint and Cinnamon? It seems to entail multiple steps - the pasting in of successive command lines. There's detailed instructional videos on YouTube but it would be unfortunate to screw up and be left unable to access the web/fixit information.

The Bravo browser seems to be available for Linux. My limited experience of it is good - if only because it shuts down ads on YouTube. Setting it as the default browser in Windows doesn't mind you prevent MS over-riding the selection so that many websites open in MS Edge.

Do you have any views on the Brave search engine? Does it truly respond to entered search terms/is it genuinely Google commercially driven algorithm free? (Brave seems to be Chrome based?) I research a lot of technical topics and find DuckDuckGo to not be very good in this regard.

Our hard wired/copper network BW is DIY using (except for the Teltonika router) Ubiquiti hardware - including a couple of wireless access points for my other half who likes to be able to wander about with an IPad. It was pretty labour intensive to plan and set up from scratch but it's been a huge improvement compared to a skimped ISP consumer level wi-fi router.

The 4G router (with an internet only SIM) was an interim solution installed as an experiment before fibre became available in our area (in Ireland - we were on a glacially slow phone line connection) but we've kept it because it's significantly cheaper and more than fast enough for our needs. It also side stepped the need to sign up to yet another weasel worded contract. We get a reasonably strong 4G signal but the key means of getting speed from it turned out to be the use of a carefully positioned and aligned antenna.

I've only been using Titan Mail for a few months - because MS without explanation shut down our Outlook/Office 365 account in a crude attempt to strong arm the use of their 2FA system. It was convenient because the hosting outfit looking after my domain had it available. It's a basic mail/contacts/calendar app that works fine but is nothing very special....

 

[Condobloke]

How do you feel about the possibility of going for a fresh/Windows removing install of Mint and Cinnamon? It seems to entail multiple steps - the pasting in of successive command lines. There's detailed instructional videos on YouTube but it would be unfortunate to screw up and be left unable to access the web/fixit information.

No. Not until you know your way around Mint, first.
This easily done....download Linux Mint (Cinnamon from : https://linuxmint.com/edition.php?id=316 .....if you are able, dowload via a torrent....by doing that you do not have to do the verification process....the torrent client does it for you.
When you have that downloaded, that .iso file can be flashed to a usb stick.....balena etcher is iusd for that... (8 gb is plenty big enough) (be aware that anything else ion the usb stick will be wiped)....when that uis done, reboot the pc and boot it to that usb stick. That will give you what is called a "LIVE" vbersion of Linux Mint (Cinnamon) which will run in Ram....it will NOT interfere with your windows install at all. Kick it around, explore it, use it, download to it etc etc etc....just be aware that if you reboot or shut down in any way that 'session' and anything you may have changed etc etc will be GONE. The Live version is meant for testing out you and your pc....does sound work, does interner work etc etc etc......if it works in the live version it will work when it is fully installed.

Do you have any views on the Brave search engine? Does it truly respond to entered search terms/is it genuinely Google commercially driven algorithm free? (Brave seems to be Chrome based?) I research a lot of technical topics and find DuckDuckGo to not be very good in this regard.

Brave search engine is ok.....still has some catching up to do. My experience with DDG is good. I use nothing else.

brave browser is good....I use it as my default. I also have downloaded a spare browser...usually Chromium & Firefox. F'fox comes with LM as default.
To download brave....get it from their website :
The instructions look like this: COPY AND PASTE FOR ACCURACY

Release Channel Installation​

Debian, Ubuntu, Mint​

sudo apt install curl

sudo curl -fsSLo /usr/share/keyrings/brave-browser-archive-keyring.gpg https://brave-browser-apt-release.s3.brave.com/brave-browser-archive-keyring.gpg
---------------------------
echo "deb [signed-by=/usr/share/keyrings/brave-browser-archive-keyring.gpg] https://brave-browser-apt-release.s3.brave.com/ stable main"|sudo tee /etc/apt/sources.list.d/brave-browser-release.list
---------------------
sudo apt update
----------------------------
sudo apt install brave-browser
--------------------------------------

Copy and paste EACH command into terminal and hit enter. I have separated each one with a line, just to show what is one command
Take a note of this....it will be useful down the track.

You will notice I have suggested you use their website for brave.....I have found the download from the LM software manager to be a bit wonky.

All other app downloads should come from the software manager when possible. They are designed for Linuix Mint, and are totally dependable.

 

[Condobloke]

Just so you will know.
Linux Mint has 3 flavours.....Cinnamon, Mate, and XFCE

Cinnamon is the flagship.....Mate in the middle...a different look, very much a windows 7 look....and XFCE is a lighter distro, but also very quick and well liked.

 

[Vaj2]

Thank you for offering a clear view CB - will proceed accordingly.

I'm going to go away now for a while to get enough work done to get some feeling for the territory....

 

[Condobloke]

A great deal of the 'learning curve' is mindset. It IS different to a windows mindset....totally

probably one of the hardest aspects, is the amount of CHOICE.

As you ask more questions, you will no doubt notice that every man and his dog has a slightly different way of approaching.handling/doing the same thing. That is their choice. It is neither right nor wrong..(mostly)
Collectively they can throw in enough answers to totally confuse you.....and they will !!

You do need to use the Live version to further acquaint yourself with the ins and out of Linux Mint (or any other OS for that matter.
When you do get a live instance fired up, Don't be scared of breaking it.....Mint is very resilient, but it can be broken. That is ok.....you just take the usb out and boot to it again and away you go.

If you happen to 'break' it when it is fully installed to a drive......for that we have Timeshift. (similar to system restore, only way better....more about that later)

 

[Condobloke]

When you want more detail to fit up a usb stick so that is bootable etc etc....just yell out

 

[Condobloke]

Linux is NOT Windows

 

[Brickwizard]

Our hard wired/copper network BW is DIY using (except for the Teltonika router) Ubiquiti hardware - including a couple of wireless access points for my other half who likes to be able to wander about with an IPad.

Looks fine to me, and if the OH is keeping IOS on her pad no changes to her connections will be required.
if however you are going to network all computers together a little extra work is required.

 

[Vaj2]

Ta for the invite to ask for help with setting up a live version of Mint on a usb stick CB. It's good to know that that it's hard to do harm via that route.
There definitely BW will be no shifting the OH away from the stock OS on her IPad so it's also good to hear that that will not be a problem.
I'm heading off to get a better handle on where it's going and in addition have to get some prep work done for a contractor (a guy with a tractor mounted hedge topper) who is to arrive in the coming days.
I as the man said will be back, but depending on how it all plays out it could be in a week or so - sooner or later......

 

[CaffeineAddict]

It sounds as though the Mint/Cinnamon route is both feasible and probably as good a Linux option as is available in our situation.

Many people here here will recommend Mint/Cinnamon to new people because it's apparently user friendly, I'm personally not fan of these types of distros but if you like it that's OK.

I personally didn't follow suggestions upon conversion from Windows to Linux because was already determined by what google told me to use for my taste.

But what ever makes you happy is better than MS bloatware.

 

[DECH]

Hi all. I’ve been researching the possibility of switching to Linux and registered on the forum yesterday.

MS abuse of the power of the Windows platform has reached intolerable levels so it's time to act. Linux seems meanwhile to be the valid alternative that restores control of the desktop to the user. It’s hard to conclude other than that cloud computing was a Trojan horse designed to end users’ control of their own computers…

The tutorials suggest that Linux Mint with Cinnamon desktop may be a good choice for personal use by a retired engineer that’s a user rather than an IT specialist. The helpful and enthusiastic mindset of the Linux community has proven refreshing. Likewise the clean and functional Mint/Cinnamon interface.

I hope this is not overdoing it, but some feedback regarding the real-world issues likely to arise in respect of the fairly basic (?) requirements listed below (matters that might arise to make the transition less than trouble-free) would be appreciated. Also to help to identify what in the list is not built into or is sketchy/best substituted in the Mint suite

There's no problem within reason with taking the time necessary to become familiar with Linux, but an ongoing requirement to de-bug stuff, make heavy use of command lines (my memory is not what it was) and find work arounds to e.g. get devices and apps working would not be so good.

Against that my inclination if it looks feasible is to go for broke – to remove Windows and install Mint in its place. (there’s nothing like having to do it to get a job done)

The computer is a fairly old (2016) but of decent spec at the time Asus UX501 VW Zen Book Pro (UK/Irish/EU model) laptop with an Intel Core i7-6700HQ 2.6 GHz CPU, 12 GB of RAM and a 475GB hard drive. (316GB currently free with 64 bit Win 10 Prof installed) The display from the spec seems to be (?) NVIDIA Ge Force GTX 960M 3840x2860x59Hz and Intel HD graphics 530 - I'm not sure what the numbers refer to.

Requirements in no particular order include:

• Reliability of function.
• Security – reliable and scam resistant, especially in the context of access to bank accounts, passwords (is this sort of information saved/protected in Mint?) and when ordering from ecommerce sites like Amazon, Ebay and independent businesses.
• Little or no unrequested use of pushy 'help' and/or selling pop ups.
• Settings stay put unless they are changed by the user.
• Free and unrestricted access to all normal commercial and other international websites.
• Reliable and straightforward transfer of existing user files and data to the new apps – mostly Titan emails, File Explorer folders and docts., contacts, bookmarks.
• Reliable exchange of documents, files etc with websites and users of Windows, Mac OS etc computers.
• Compatibility with a Teltonika 4G router based hard wired CAT6A home network.
• Compatibility with current mouse, keyboard, hub, switch, headphones etc.
• Email – doesn’t have to be fancy but should allow word processor level document formatting. (currently using Titan Mail)
• Office suite apps of decent quality – as above.
• Good search engine capability - hopefully including means to avoid Google’s disregard of search terms in favour of presenting one half page listing of vaguely relevant highest bidders.
• Browsing free of interference – including uncensored access to international sites reporting matters of geopolitical interest, acceptability to bank security systems etc.
• Printing to/scanning from a Canon GX2050 three in one.
• Reliable data backup – at least to local hard drive(s). Are cloud based options possible without walking back into the clutches of big tech?
• Safe (malware and bug free) access to basic everyday apps. such as maps etc.
• Basic photo, drawing and graphics manipulation. (not professional level)
• VPN
• Access to YouTube (advert free – currently achieving this using Brave) and similar streaming sites.
• The ability to make low-cost web phone calls would be nice but is not essential.
• The ability to open and read CAD files would be nice but is not essential.
• Gaming is not required.

A related matter is that of finding a similar mobile phone solution - the pushy infestation of a recently bought smart phone by Google is similarly unacceptable. Thoughts on this matter would also be appreciated.

Does there exist a practical means of stepping free of their tentacles short of going back to a basic phone?

Thanks…

I was considering Mint; have spent about 90 mins trying to verify the checksum/signature; strictly speaking the Mint site clearly indicates that it may be checked on Windows or Mint which rules out my Peppermint OS or Mac. Not an attractive introduction; they should specify the limit of two OS's for checking their checksums. I tried with some AI advice but after about thirty command line attempts ..... It raises an obvious question also about the remainder of the documentation.