Out of the frying pan into the Fire with LAN cards.

Nik-Ken-Bah

Active Member
Or do you have a different edition?
I have Win 7 Ultimate since the Pro version doesn't display Oriental characters only little square boxes and I like listening to Zhongguo music. :) and I like the look of their characters.
 


Nik-Ken-Bah

Active Member
Just a quick one and to the side of the thread.
What would be a good router to use as I am planning to get the missus a laptop with a ryzen processor with Ubuntu installed for her birthday. I personally am not overly struck on WiFi but the missus wants WiFi and I was thinking of using the router to plug the cable in from Goldie so she is hardwired so to speak and also connecting the WiFi to it for the missus's use.
So what would be a good brand to use?

I found one that is designed in Latvia but as usual made in China. called Mikrotik (read it as microtek)
and this is what controls is the following

RouterOS is a stand-alone operating system based on the Linux v2.6 kernel, and our goal here at MikroTik is to provide all these features with a quick and simple installation and an easy to use interface.

So just maybe it will work quite well with Linux distros. :):)
 
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atanere

Well-Known Member
In post #79, talking about your ISP "box"...
Is very much like the telephone cable boxes except it has a lot of LAN cable jacks
I think this is an Ethernet router... but we've never figured this out yet for sure in this thread. Do you intend to replace this original box with a wireless router instead? Or add the wireless router as an additional device?

My networking skills are not very "versatile," especially with non-standard arrangements. I've never hooked up 2 routers in a home network, but I know it can be done. I'd recommend a new thread about adding a new secondary router to your network.

But you may also first want to firmly solve this thread and get a full understanding of your network details, which I think all of us are still lacking so far (though we are getting closer). Adding a new network device may only add to your current frustration if you cannot configure it properly. In doing a bit of research, I find that a "WAN Mini Port" (which is what gives you a 1 Gbps connection) is a software driver for PPPoE (Point to Point Protocol Over Ethernet). Your Windows 7 seems to be configured this way, and it works. Linux needs to match these network settings.

Linux can do PPPoE networking too, but so far I'm still confused about the CHAP authentication shown in your screenshots. I'm over my head here swimming in the deep end of the pool... so all I can do is try to Google up information that might apply. I do find some info about setting up PPPoE in Linux, but I don't want to steer you there until we can be more sure about it, and maybe @dos2unix will have some better ideas about this.

Do you know the username and password that your internet needs to connect to your ISP's network. I think that PPPoE needs these. Don't tell us this info... I just want to confirm that this information was provided to you from the ISP, and that you have it. If you attempt to configure PPPoE on Linux, you'll need this info.

It's a long, hard journey... this one. I hope that we can get you there! :D
 

Nik-Ken-Bah

Active Member
Do you intend to replace this original box with a wireless router instead?
Bit hard to do as it belongs to the ISP provider "Link "

"WAN Mini Port" (which is what gives you a 1 Gbps connection) is a software driver for PPPoE (Point to Point Protocol Over Ethernet). Your Windows 7 seems to be configured this way, and it works. Linux needs to match these network settings
Thanks for that it gave me a lead and I found a few things one being this


This is vid was made by a Russian.
and the following


and this one


So I will have a squizz at the man page tomorrow when I tickle Goldie awake. That is if it is there.
 

atanere

Well-Known Member
Bit hard to do as it belongs to the ISP provider "Link "
I don't know the circumstances in Ukraine, or with your particular ISP. Here in the US, I can purchase my own cable modem/router (combo or separate devices), and then I get the cable company technician on the phone to configure it for me (they need the MAC address of the modem). If I purchase my own, I no longer have to pay a monthly rent to the ISP for the modem. And, in fact, this is what I do.

The configuration of that box (the center of your home network) is where all of your connection trouble seems to focus. Maybe your ISP "requires" the PPPoE connection, but I don't know that either. Maybe they would also allow simple DHCP instead. It's their network, and they may be rigid in their connection requirements, or maybe not.

So, you've already Googled up all I know about PPPoE with Linux! :cool::D I'm not sure about jumping in with both feet yet though.... again, partly because of the CHAP authentication we see in Windows. I think that ultimately, you need PPPoE to get Linux on your internet. Maybe it will be easy, but so far I can't get my hopes up too much. :eek:o_O:D

Bedtime in your neck of the woods, I think. Have a good night!

Cheers
 

Nik-Ken-Bah

Active Member
Here in the US, I can purchase my own cable modem/router (combo or separate devices), and then I get the cable company technician on the phone to configure it for me
Here they put in their own cables and I am not quite sure but it seems to be optic fibre to the node and then copper from the node to the computer just like they are doing in Auss. The only time you have to buy a modem is for ADSL service through the likes of Ukrtel the main non-mobile phone carrier.
There is another ISP provider but I am not sure about it though will have to try and get the missus to help me check them out and see what they provide and how. With the current ISP I get unlimited downloads and they are fairly stable with connecting to them and when we do have an outage they get their line up and running pretty quick.

I looked but both PPPoE and PPPoE-server are not in my man pages.

Don't know if you have looked at this page in Wikipedia on PPPoE.

 

Nik-Ken-Bah

Active Member
again, partly because of the CHAP authentication we see in Windows.
I just remembered when I changed locations and had the line set-up I was connected to my ISP but we had to telephone them and they I think set-up the CHAP authentication. May have to go and see a friend who teaches English and get him to help me talk to my ISP and find out if they are the ones that set-up the CHAP authentication.
So much info stored away it is just like visiting a vast library and looking for an insignificant little piece of paper or vellum. :):)
 

atanere

Well-Known Member
So much info stored away it is just like visiting a vast library and looking for an insignificant little piece of paper or vellum.
I know the feeling! I'm pretty rusty with networking, and I was never that good in the first place, so I keep scratching my head with your setup. But it works in Windows... and by golly it will work in Linux too! :D

But using PPPoE is something I have not done in a very long time. That's why I do want you to get a good handle on what you've got before adding any new NIC or new wireless router. The router may actually not be too bad, but I can't really begin to guess about that.


Don't know if you have looked at this page in Wikipedia on PPPoE.
That's a good article. I love Wikipedia! :D
 

atanere

Well-Known Member
I know you're heading to bed, but I just started searching some more and also found this article. Could it be so easy as to open your Network Connections, Edit Connections, Add New Connection, select PPPoE, enter your settings... and presto!

Not saying it will work, but another way to look at setting it up. It might work. I set up a brief dummy connection, and I see CHAP is even available inside the settings.

G'nite
 

Nik-Ken-Bah

Active Member
Thanks @atanere for that appreciated.
 

Nik-Ken-Bah

Active Member
@atanere The reason that Win 7 can connect to the internet is because it is able to set-up a virtual WAN port. I just happen to be reading something about routers and guess what they also are?
WAN ports.
Looking at pictures of routers and some of them had written near the input side RJ 47 jack "WAN" whilst others called it Internet.
What I think is my problem is that the Realtek NIC cannot see a WAN port only LAN ports. So if I bung in a router between the RJ 47 jack on the NIC and the Internet Plug from the ISP this just maybe what we need to hit the line and chuck out the Toshiba HD.
 

atanere

Well-Known Member
Most routers I've seen only have one WAN port, and that is the incoming internet from your modem (ISP box). I have seen some with one WAN port, and then several more that are WAN/LAN... so they can be both. Your computer should plug into a LAN port, or a WAN/LAN should be okay too.

I don't really know why your Windows settings called your setup a "WAN Mini Port"... but I'm not too concerned about it. WAN (Wide Area Network) is usually meant to be the internet, as opposed to LAN, your Local Area Network (your personal computer NIC's).
 

Nik-Ken-Bah

Active Member
WAN (Wide Area Network) is usually meant to be the internet

and this


Some interesting block diagrams in this article.


And should ye be wondering why I stuck this in here for later reference

 

atanere

Well-Known Member
All very good articles. I don't know if you spotted it, but one reminder that I noticed was that if/when you add a 2nd router, it will connect (with a cable) from one of its LAN ports to a LAN port on your ISP box. The WAN port on the new router is not used.
 

Nik-Ken-Bah

Active Member
The WAN port on the new router is not used.
That maybe as it is being used more of as switch but with the routers capability to send packets to the designated computer or device. Where as a switch shoves the same packet to all the computers and devices connected to it. And since it connected to the main router it itself has no need to do the same processing and sending of packets to the ISP thus the wide world so in that case the wan jack is made redundant.
And yes I did notice that. :)
 

Nik-Ken-Bah

Active Member
Well the router is up and running but Win 7 only recognises it as another network for media.
And it itself won't connect to the internet through it. Had to reconnect the switch that only operates at 100Mbps.
But I still could not even launch the window directly to the router.
But this raises a question. Since that is the case there is a puzzle piece still missing, What is it?
I am wondering could it be that in creating the mini WAN that Win7 dumped a piece of code into the NIC so that it only runs on Win 7's code.
Were this to be the case, then no matter what I do in Mint the NIC is not going to be able to read it!
 

atanere

Well-Known Member
I am wondering could it be that in creating the mini WAN that Win7 dumped a piece of code into the NIC so that it only runs on Win 7's code.
Were this to be the case, then no matter what I do in Mint the NIC is not going to be able to read it!
No, I do not think that is possible.

I don't know what to tell you. Is Ukraine so different from the rest of the world with networking? This should not be so hard! Is there any chance you can find a local computer expert, like a university student, or computer store employee, who can come to your home and help you set up your network (with both WIndows and Linux)? Many large cities have "Linux User Groups" (LUG's) where Linux enthusiasts gather and help one another... maybe Kyiv has such a group too?

Maybe @JulienCC or @dos2unix or @wizardfromoz will have some better ideas.
 
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Nik-Ken-Bah

Active Member
Is Ukraine so different from the rest of the world with networking?
No it is not any different to the rest of the world in regards to networking.
I was thinking along those lines myself, just have to track down a Ukrainian Linux forum and go from there.
I run up the Toshiba HD to-day and guess what Win 7 now recognises the router so go bloody figure?

I am also considering to remount Mint and take it from there.
 

Nik-Ken-Bah

Active Member
I believe I have come to an understanding why I cannot access the net through Linux Mint.
Now hear me out on this.:)
When MS set up the mini WAN port it commandeered the NIC and turned it into a router.
I know even when my HP Laptop was up and running every so often I would get this message "there is another device using the same IP address. I got this once when I set up this computer but the other day when I was trying to install the router I received the same message. In other words there was a conflict of addresses.

How can this arise?
It arises because when the Mini WAN port was established it converted the NIC into a router. From my understanding about routers is that conflicts arise because different devices are given the same address. This being the case then since MS when it set-up the Mini WAN (router ) did not assign a different address for the motherboard and it also doesn't recognise the MikroTik router as a router just as another device and automatically assigned it to being used for media.

Yesterday I was trying to access the router but its control interface could not be accessed at all unlike when I initially had a crack at setting it up I could and did access it.
All Google Chrome came up with is "site cannot be reached. "
Now if MS has commandeered the NIC to use as a router this means that when you log out of Win 7 it either shuts the NIC down or it silences the NIC to preserve its router settings.

Should this be the case this means that another OS trying to use the NIC are unable to because it has been disabled.

Therefore this means that I am going to have to buy a Intel based PCI NIC and install Wine into Mint to properly set-up the router I do have.

In the interim it looks Like that I am going to have to buy a purely WiFi router besides the laptop for the missus. Which I can run via the TP-Link switch that I also have.
 

atanere

Well-Known Member
When MS set up the mini WAN port it commandeered the NIC and turned it into a router.
No, it takes at least two NIC's to make a router. One NIC cannot be a router. A "router" directs traffic between two (or more) dissimilar networks (like the internet and your home LAN). You can turn a computer into a router, but it needs at least two NIC's inside. A NIC can be either wired or wireless.


I know even when my HP Laptop was up and running every so often I would get this message "there is another device using the same IP address. I got this once when I set up this computer but the other day when I was trying to install the router I received the same message. In other words there was a conflict of addresses.

How can this arise?
This is a configuration problem. If you use just one router, and it uses DHCP to issue IP addresses to the computers in your home LAN, I don't think you will ever have this problem. That you see this error is telling you that you have a configuration problem. You may or may not be using DHCP... this is set in your ISP's router (the "box")... and you've not looked into that. This is your first step to solve your problem. You must know how the ISP router is configured so that you can configure your LAN to match it.

There is nothing to indicate that any hardware in your network is defective... not the ISP router (the "box"), not any NIC's in any computer, not your switch, and not your new MicroTik. But adding new devices only complicates your problem until you figure out how to properly configure your network. I don't think you need to buy yet another WiFi device to make your wife's laptop work. The MicroTik should work just fine. But again, any device needs the settings of the local network so that it can be configured properly. The "Quick Start Guide" for the MicroTik says it is "pre-configured" and should work as soon as you plug it in, but it seems that is not true in your case, so you may need to configure it manually.

You may can get enough information from your Windows 7 network settings, since it's the only thing that works... but I'm not sure. (We have failed so far.) You may still need to look at your ISP router settings too. I strongly recommend that you get someone locally who knows how to setup a home network to come over and assist you, and get that person to setup your Linux Mint and your MicroTik while they are there... a complete job. You need someone knowledgeable who can physically see your equipment and can step through all the many different pages of settings in your ISP router, if needed. If your router is using Static IP Addressing instead of DHCP, then you need to make a full list of the static IP addresses that each device on your network uses. You set these IP addresses manually yourself on each device, so you have to be sure that you do not create duplicates. If you use this method, you will need to set up the IP address on the new laptop that you will buy for your wife.


I believe I have come to an understanding why I cannot access the net through Linux Mint.
The same computer and same NIC works with Windows... and Mint doesn't work. So Mint is not configured properly to match your LAN. From the previous Windows settings you showed us, and since standard Ethernet over DHCP does not work, I am pretty certain that you need to "Add Network Connection" with your Network Manager and enter the proper settings. We suspect these to be PPPoE (and CHAP authentication), but you have not successfully done this. There may be more configuration information needed that we have not discovered. Mint will work, I have no doubt in my mind at all. But you must set it up properly to match your local network.

You cannot identify what your ISP router brand/model is (no markings, you said earlier)... so it would be very risky for us to try to instruct you on how to log into it and investigate its settings. If you change something in there then you may not have any internet at all.... that would be bad. Your ISP may have provided documentation to you that says all we need to know about the router's settings, but we haven't heard that from you either. Mint only needs to be configured properly, and it will talk to your router and to the internet.
 

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