Linus told someone that they should have been aborted.....?

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blackneos940

Guest
So I heard about Linus Torvalds saying this..... I even saw him try to rationalize it during a video shot at a Debian conference..... He also called someone too stupid to find their Mother's um..... Anyway, it's not enough to make me leave Linux, and not ONE of us is perfect, but..... Really??..... First I hear that Richard Stallman is a fanatic, and NOW I hear that Linus, and even some of the top contributors to the Kernel are mean to people..... I had so much respect for Linus, and the others..... YOU guys have been nice to me, and for that, I'm grateful..... I try not to be mean, and I hope I seem competent..... I..... I don't know..... What are your thoughts.....? Does all this put a stain on the FOSS community.....? I can promise you that if those horror stories had happened to me, I would not have started using Linux, and joined sites like this..... But I met you guys first..... :) And I learned that there are FAR more kind people (people with flaws, yes, like myself, of course), than mean or inconsiderate people in this huge Community....... :)
 
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Darren Hale

Guest
It is indeed unfortunate when people in the Community resort to name calling and being rude to on another. I have myself been the victim of such things.

It does not stop me using Linux though as there are as you say nice down to earth people who take the time to be patient and answer questions. I don't agree with Linus's Brain explosion moments where he swears at people it is unprofessional.

I have theory and it is only my theory when discussing an issue for example the best way to do something debate the issue not argue, because you can win a debate but nobody wins an argument - what is the difference...........

Debating: (What Politician's used to do) is present your point of you with well thought points without getting personal and verbally attacking someone else.

Arguing: (What Politicians do now) Resorting to playing the man not the ball and attacking a person verbally often with insults.

So all I can say is Linus has done much for the Community but his behavior at times is unfortunate. So stay strong enjoy Linux and we must all learn not emulate such behavior. Sigh the lost art of clever debating. Glad you are part of the community.
 
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blackneos940

Guest
It is indeed unfortunate when people in the Community resort to name calling and being rude to on another. I have myself been the victim of such things.

It does not stop me using Linux though as there are as you say nice down to earth people who take the time to be patient and answer questions. I don't agree with Linus's Brain explosion moments where he swears at people it is unprofessional.

I have theory and it is only my theory when discussing an issue for example the best way to do something debate the issue not argue, because you can win a debate but nobody wins an argument - what is the difference...........

Debating: (What Politician's used to do) is present your point of you with well thought points without getting personal and verbally attacking someone else.

Arguing: (What Politicians do now) Resorting to playing the man not the ball and attacking a person verbally often with insults.

So all I can say is Linus has done much for the Community but his behavior at times is unfortunate. So stay strong enjoy Linux and we must all learn not emulate such behavior. Sigh the lost art of clever debating. Glad you are part of the community.

Thanks for the reply..... :) I know..... Give credit where credit is due..... But I think that more people in the community need to tell him to shut the he!! up..... :\ I mean, if *I* were like that, I may not LIKE hearing YOU tell me that, but I would really be better off hearing it..... Anyway, I AM glad to be part of this community, though..... :) And in the Spirit of that, I hope to one day make a REALLY cool Program for you guys..... Open Source, of course..... ;D
 
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Darren Hale

Guest
Blackneos940 I look forward to your work by the way the name is very cool.
 
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blackneos940

Guest
Blackneos940 I look forward to your work by the way the name is very cool.
Thanks..... :D I'm also on YouTube, under the same name..... :) I make Whisper Videos and ASMR (Y'know that feeling you get when someone lightly brushes your Neck or Head.....?) :D

Also, here's some C that I'm <b>just</b> beginning to learn..... XD It has some similarities to Python3 in particular, and it is, of course, Open Source..... :) Anyway, here ya' go!:

#include <stdio.h>

#include <conio.h>

main()

{
printf("Hello World!!");

}

Aren't you just jealous of my skills.....? XD No, seriously, what do "<stdio.h>" and "<conio.h>" mean.....? :\

Also, I'm listening to a Video on YouTube about a scammer calling from "Windows"..... XD Maybe, since I use Linux, I should give THEM a ring.....? >: )
 
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blackneos940

Guest
Blackneos940 I look forward to your work by the way the name is very cool.
Also, I'd like to try AnitaOS..... :) I've only got this small Chromebook SSD, but I could run it off of a USB, through Virtualbox, like I did with NT..... :D You must be INCREDIBLE if you know how to make your own Distro..... :3

Also, thank you for AnitaOS..... :3 When I get better at C, want me to make you a Soda Pop Distro of Linux, complete with Soda-y goodness.....? :> Or it could be whatever you want..... :D I wonder if anybody has made a GUIDE to tinkering with the Kernel, though....... Y'know, some comments in the file, like "Change x, and it does this."..... Or something like that..... :)

Namaste, Brother..... :)
 
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Darren Hale

Guest
Mmm Don't know how that will run on an Chromebook it is for real old hardware. Has a very old kernel and Xorg. Thanks I don't think I am incredible, just lucky Puppy Linux for which it's loosely based on has excellent re-mastering tools like Woofy.
 
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blackneos940

Guest
Mmm Don't know how that will run on an Chromebook it is for real old hardware. Has a very old kernel and Xorg. Thanks I don't think I am incredible, just lucky Puppy Linux for which it's loosely based on has excellent re-mastering tools like Woofy.
It worked fine..... :) I still think you did a great job, though.... :D What is Woofy.....? :3 Oh yeah, I found a few potential bugs...... Nothing serious, just little things..... I made a Database of this in Libre Office, so here ya go!!..... ^^
 

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JasKinasis

Guest
No, seriously, what do "<stdio.h>" and "<conio.h>" mean.....? :\
stdio.h is a C header file containing the function definitions for input and output. So it contains I/O functions like printf, scanf etc. which are all part of standard C.
In order to use any of the functions defined in stdio.h, you must first #include the header file. The #include statement in C/C++ is analogous to the import statement in Python.

On the other hand, conio.h is a non-standard header file used by 20 year old Borland compilers,. It contains some proprietary extensions that Borland added for doing various things in the console (moving the cursor with gotoxy(), changing text color etc). The use of this header is specific to old Borland compilers for Windows. It is not portable and cannot be used under Linux (because it doesn't exist).
If you try compiling the code you posted under gcc on Linux, it would not compile at all. It would bomb out almost immediately, complaining that conio.h could not be found. There is another problem in the code you posted, more on that in a bit!

There are a large number of C (and even C++) articles and 'tutorials' online which #include conio.h. But, as mentioned; it is only available to ancient, outdated Borland compilers (which again, are only available for Windows). For some reason a lot of academic institutes in places like India and Pakistan are still using these woefully outdated compilers.... I really don't know why. Surely it would make sense to allow their students to use a decent free compiler like gcc, which is up to date, is standards compliant, is available on multiple platforms and will allow the students to learn more modern C and C++ practices! But perhaps it is the teachers/faculty in these institutions who are unwilling to change and are happy to be teaching their students outdated practices!
Either way, because of this there seems to be a proliferation of articles, tutorials and questions on forums from students who are still being subjected to these old C/C++ compilers!

Another thing about these old compilers is that they predate the formalisation of the C and C++ ISO standards. So lots of these Borland specific tutorials allow outdated, non-standard things like main functions that return void, or have no return value at all (like the example you posted!). The C and C++ standards state that the main() function must always return an int.

So a more correct example of hello world in C would be:
Code:
#include <stdio.h>

int main()
{
    printf("Hello World!\n");
    return 0;
}
If your program requires command line arguments, the following are also acceptable, standard compliant signatures for the main function:
Code:
int main(int argc, char *argv[])
or
Code:
int main(int argc, char **argv)
Both of the above are equivalent!

Basically, if you see a C or C++ tutorial that contains "conio.h" or has a signature for main that is anything other than one of the three int signatures you can see in the above snippets, then avoid it like the plague as it is outdated!

I'm getting tired, so I'm going to shut up now! :)
 
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Darren Hale

Guest
Woofy is a small program which allows you to edit an ISO like well Puppy Linux 4.12 and heavily update. Edit Wallpapers and replace with new ones. Choose your Desktop ICEWM or JWM or XFCE etc. Also allows to Delete and add programs.

A new ISO is created and then burn it to CD.

More here: http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=57037
 
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blackneos940

Guest
Oh, OK!..... :D Well, to be honest, that <conio.h> thing wasn't in the first Tutorial I learned..... :) I must've thoughtlessly added it..... :) But I'll take your advice..... I had no IDEA I was going THAT route in my Programming..... D: Yeah, I want to keep it Free and Open Source..... :) Anywho..... I have this Folder in Documents called Testing_Grounds, (on both Windows RT and Linux), where I keep various OTHER Folders, which include examples of <b>other</b> Programming Languages to be studied..... :) It's called C_Files (while most of the OTHER Programming Languages are called "Examples of" X, and so on.... :))..... So I'll replace THAT code with the one you gave me..... :D How does <b>that</b> sound.....? :)
 
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blackneos940

Guest
Woofy is a small program which allows you to edit an ISO like well Puppy Linux 4.12 and heavily update. Edit Wallpapers and replace with new ones. Choose your Desktop ICEWM or JWM or XFCE etc. Also allows to Delete and add programs.

A new ISO is created and then burn it to CD.

More here: http://murga-linux.com/puppy/viewtopic.php?t=57037
Ah, ok..... :) So..... Would you know how to fix those Bugs, then.....? I'm only a Novice at C myself..... :( Or is the Notepad written in Python.....? :) I'm better at THAT..... :3
 
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Yesyesloud

Guest
So I heard about Linus Torvalds saying this.....
Linus was born in a very liberal country (in the moral sense, not economical one, as respected Finnish economists keep saying Finland is suffering big time with free market newcomers), I guess that's why he has no problems with kidding about abortion.

He doesn't hold grudges about acknowledging he's an atheist (some titans in this field, like Gates, regret saying so in order to keep their public image "clean").

There's obviously nothing nice in insulting the others, but Linus' more honest than most big money computer guys in many senses, that you can't deny.

Anyway, it's not enough to make me leave Linux, and not ONE of us is perfect, but..... Really??..... First I hear that Richard Stallman is a fanatic,
Linux is available for everyone, free of charge. We should always feel welcome and grateful for that.

What exactly have you heard about Stallman, though?

and NOW I hear that Linus, and even some of the top contributors to the Kernel are mean to people..... I had so much respect for Linus, and the others.....
The problem is that kernel engineers must be incredibly skilled... And sensitive as to their work, which you can say affects life in general nowadays (near 100% of the Internet is powered by Linux).

Linus has insulted some kernel contributors himself. One has to bear huge amounts of responsibility before applying for such a job. Kernel issues can affect thousands when not millions of people.

I find him a great guy. I love knowing he almost throws people out of his home after spotting their iphones (he's generally kidding anyway). He gets tons of emails/messages, work-related mostly. It's natural that some subjects enrage him... Besides, everyone knows of his strong personality.

Does all this put a stain on the FOSS community.....?
Sorreh. The FOSS community is crystal-clear if compared with the proprietary conglomerates.

I can promise you that if those horror stories had happened to me,
Please don't tell this to major developers. However, keep in mind our forum pals will try their best to be kind to you ;)

But I met you guys first..... :) And I learned that there are FAR more kind people (people with flaws, yes, like myself, of course), than mean or inconsiderate people in this huge Community....... :)
Great that you've found us first... Kept yourself away from some "free" name calling.

Despite their famous unfriendliness, I find that the kernel creator and its maintainers/developers are as considerate as most kind people around in forums, measuring how many benefit from their work.

In a practical view, they're even more considerate.

It's also undeniable that being polite to people on Linux communities is important, attracting more desktop users.
 
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blackneos940

Guest
Funny as it is, posting a Meme doesn't invalidate something..... He even expressed regret for saying those things..... I mean, these guys are contributing to a Kernel which nearly the whole WORLD uses..... It pisses me off when things like that happen.....
 
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blackneos940

Guest
It's still abrasive to tell someone that, in effect, they should have been denied the chance to LIVE..... I've met other Liberals (I'm a Conservative myself), who would find that insult APPALLING..... Yes, honesty IS a good thing: That's what even made me LIKE him so much in the first place..... But insulting Developers with the things he's said isn't very productive, and it sure as HECK isn't going to bode well for Linux in the long run..... I've heard some people say that it's because he's from a different Culture..... That only goes so far.... Besides, the whole WORLD is using Linux now, not just some people in Helsinki..... As for Richard Stallman, he made a comment about Emacs Virgins: "And we also have the cult of the virgin of Emacs. The virgin of Emacs is any female who has not yet learned how to use Emacs. And in the church of Emacs we believe that taking her Emacs virginity away is a blessed act." This may be misinterpreted on my part..... Nonetheless, if it comes down to it, I've gotten to a point in my life, after being called so many names for being me (which I would NEVER change), and lately, if someone's being abrasive, I just call them out on it..... Plain and simple. I don't expect Linus, or ANY of you or myself, to be perfect..... But Linus needs to be more kind..... He seems as such when he isn't tearing apart the Devs..... People DO benefit, but unkindness is unkindness, whether you mop floors at a business, or work on a Kernel for the whole World.....
 

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