I'm a huge fan of academia...

KGIII

Administrator
Staff member
Gold Supporter
Joined
Jul 23, 2020
Messages
13,101
Reaction score
12,127
Credits
108,063
I love learning. I love higher learning. I love institutions of learning. I love the scientific method. (I could go on...)

Now that we've established that...

I had some friends stop by. Their son is in college for a computer-related degree. I forget which but it sounds like a fairly basic intro to computer science, but without the math. So, he might actually be in one of those qausi-trade school things. I did not pay as much attention as I should have.

Anyhow, their son knows I'm a computer guy and have an education and all that. So, he decided to talk to me. I'm not sure of his motives but it might have just been that he wanted to impress or at least not be bored. Maybe he was trying to make his parents proud.

Well, he was going on about these two 'new' things. He was going on and on about how these 'new' ARM processors were going to take over the computer industry and how RISC (also 'new') was the most important modern change to hardware and software.

I didn't have the heart to tell him that both of those, ARM and RISC, are older than his parents.

I don't know whose fault it is. He may be learning impaired or the school may have low-rent teachers.
 


Maybe, he saw you as 'old' and decided (unwisely) that your knowledge was also old....and so he chose to "talk at your level' ?
 
Maybe, he saw you as 'old' and decided (unwisely) that your knowledge was also old....and so he chose to "talk at your level' ?

He's aware that I use Linux and spent a long time with Windows on the desktop. He should then be aware that my knowledge is current. He's also aware that I'm one of the people who took traffic modeling into the computer age. So...

But, maybe? That doesn't seem like the situation but that could have been.

Even under those circumstances, both ARM and RISC are very old. They're not as old as I am but they're quite literally older than his parents. His parents are both from the mid/late 80s.

RISC is from as early as the 60s. ARM is from Acorn. They were in the late 70s but it wasn't until the early 80s that they had a mass-produced computer with the BBC Micro.

I don't think I'd classify those as new to anyone who alive today and even a wee bit familiar with computers.
 
Kids these days!

But, on the other hand, there's always something "new" in ARM - isn't Apple all proud of their ARM based CPUs? And it hasn't there been new -interest- in RISC V lately? (or am I mis-remembering some title where I didn't actually read the article?)

Hmmm... new phrase: "Schools for the teaching impaired"
 
You did well to hold your peace :) In talking to many IT managers over the years. Many of them are looking to hire people with hands on experience and not a College degree. For some of the very reasons that you mentioned about modern education, Not that I'm against it. But they have lost touch with the real world in some cases and are teaching old out dated methods. One It manger for a large company told me he looks for people that are self taught and still learning. Rather than those that have degrees in computer science and think they know it all.
 
You did well to hold your peace :) In talking to many IT managers over the years. Many of them are looking to hire people with hands on experience and not a College degree. For some of the very reasons that you mentioned about modern education, Not that I'm against it. But they have lost touch with the real world in some cases and are teaching old out dated methods. One It manger for a large company told me he looks for people that are self taught and still learning. Rather than those that have degrees in computer science and think they know it all.
Long ago, when I was in college, I preferred evening courses instead of day time courses because the teachers were mostly -not- professional professors. They were people who actually used the subject matter they were teaching in their day jobs. The result was a better learning experience and a more laid back classroom.

One teacher said all his tests would be open-book tests because, why not? If you need to know this stuff in real life and you're the least bit iffy about remembering it, you're going to just look it up anyway. I learned more in that class and the learning "stuck" better in my brain than in any of my day time classes - and I enjoyed the class a lot more, too.
 
And it hasn't there been new -interest- in RISC V lately?

I suspect the younger generation discovered RISC and decided that it was a great thing. So, yeah, they're pretty interested in RISC.

hose that can, do

those that cant, teach

those that cant teach, manage

LOL I've done all three of those things. I've even seen people who excelled in all three of those things.

But, I get your point...

Rather than those that have degrees in computer science and think they know it all.

Colleges and universities have often turned into what appears to be trade schools. This can be blamed on the concept that 'everyone needs to go to college'. No... No, everyone does not need to go to college. In fact, going to college can be financially detrimental to a large subset of people.

I don't think it was the colleges/universities that posited that everyone needs to go to college. I think they're just left holding the bag. Of course, they do love money so it's not like they actively went out of their way to let folks know that college isn't always a requirement. (Or at least it shouldn't be.)

Anyhow, it used to be that you went to college to learn how to learn.

These days, you go to college to prepare you for the job market. (Some schools are the exception.)
 
Colleges and universities have often turned into what appears to be trade schools. This can be blamed on the concept that 'everyone needs to go to college'. No... No, everyone does not need to go to college. In fact, going to college can be financially detrimental to a large subset of people.

I fell for that one back in the day - I didnt do well in college. I've got my reasons but they're basically just excuses - I was young and dumb. some years after that I went to an IT trade school and that led me to where I am today.

out of all of the friends I made growing up, in school, and then in "higher" education, I'd hazard a guess that not more than 30% actually used their degrees - like, a buddy of mine was in the forestry track but now he's management in a car dealership. another guy got a degree in welding but then joined the military (and his MOS has nothing to do with welding). another friend did the music teacher track and now he's in a relatively successful soul/funk fusion band.
 
buddy of mine was in the forestry track but now he's management in a car dealership. another guy got a degree in welding but then joined the military

I'd like to hope those were done at trade schools and not a college.

College should mean you learn to learn.

See, a Ph.D. is a measure of your ability to learn. In order to get a Ph.D. (in any STEM field) you need to do new research. Your thesis needs to be both novel and must forward the art. You're not regurgitating what others have learned, but showing that you yourself can do proper research with proper tools (inventing them where necessary) and then have that research validated by a jury of your soon-to-be peers.

So, anyone with a solid college education SHOULD be able to transfer those skills to most any other field. They should be able to learn the material needed to complete the required tasks.

Alas, businesses require a degree to answer a phone these days. Higher learning, like any valid business, has adjusted to the market - including raising costs to what the market will bear. There are some holdouts, those more reputable schools, but I'm looking at things in aggregate.

After I retired, I spent a couple of years teaching math at a nearby university. I think the most telling aspect of that is that I spent a couple of years - and not more than that. My goal was altruistic as it wasn't for financial gain.

At the same time, my daughter (here on vacation, helping to explain my fewer posts) is a pediatrician and got a great education. In fact, she now works at the school. Well, at the hospital attached to the school.

My son dropped out of a bio degree because it was just rote memory and not engaging enough for him. In his position, I'd have done much the same.
 
When I was working on my PhD it was a little more difficult that it is now: I gow very general draft of my project and I had to fill out all the blanks myself. If I could not do it on my own then I had to drop out of the program. Today, students expect way more assistance and if help is not given they complain. Maybe that is way people drop so easily from whatever degree track as it cost less effort now.
Also I think that it is impossible (at least in experimental science) to be a good teacher and good scientitst at the same time. It just require too much time focusing on one to do another.
While I never was a teacher, teaching require a lot of time to prepare.
Also regarding first post: I would be more forgiving: young people are just that - young ;)
 
4 year degrees each

That is absurd - in my humble opinion. Though, last time I looked, logging was the most dangerous industry in the region. I also live in logging country (even living on old paper mill land) and I'm pretty sure that none of them have a 4 year degree. Heck, you can become an arborist in less time.

It just require too much time focusing on one to do another.

I think that would depend on how many TAs they had, plus their ability to use undergrads.

As an aside, I've often considered going back and getting a doctorate in philosophy of Mathematics.

While the Ph.D. stands for Doctor of Philosophy it's not really the same thing.
 
While the Ph.D. stands for Doctor of Philosophy it's not really the same thing.
It is derived from greek and means "love of wisdom". In Europe one can get PhD in all natural sciences including math. I got PhD in biology (gene regulation). These days PhD title is a bit watered down and almost every specialty has PhD.


I think that would depend on how many TAs they had, plus their ability to use undergrads.
While working at different universities, I never had to teach (as in school). I had PhD candidates but I never had to prepare lectures or work with larger groups of students. PhD candidates are required to be independent. They are just reporting scientific progress. Eventually we discuss problems to overcome. Of course this is how it works in experimental sciences. I don't know much about theoretical sciences.
 
It is derived from greek and means "love of wisdom".

LOL I studied Greek. I've forgotten most of it but studied Greek for a couple of years.

I had PhD candidates but I never had to prepare lectures or work with larger groups of students.

I did all that stuff, including a variety of projects. In some cases, I'd get a stipend for my efforts and that was important to me. I used to be pretty poor. I did manage to finish without any student loans, which was important to me at the time. I was able to use a lot of grants and scholarships. Though, if you're paying for grad school, you're doing it wrong and probably should have stopped sooner.
 

Members online


Top