Desktop Linux Brick Wall

davidP7

New Member
Credits
164
In the past I have been a desktop Linux naysayer, but I think most of my objections regarding using Linux on the desktop have been fully addressed or at least greatly mitigated. There are versions of desktop Linux that are all over the map in every category. The two that seem to be the overall most consistent, compatible, and reliable are Manjaro and Ubuntu. Those are the two that I am referring to when I say "desktop linux". Not the ones that refuse to boot ever again after I change my desktop resolution, take over a minute to boot on modern hardware, or crash when I open Google Chrome.

-Current versions of desktop Linux are as fast as and at certain tasks better than Windows.
-Driver support for core components is close to flawless although there are often huge hiccups like spotty printer support.
-For certain tasks there are open source programs that are indistinguishable from their Windows versions. Kodi and Chromium spring to mind.

While this is all great, there is still a huge problem with Linux on the desktop that will likely never be solved.

Let me give you an example.

I had my Manjaro system set up and I was able to watch videos, download videos, and browse the internet. That is mostly all I do on my living room computer, so yay. I don't need Windows on this computer https://mobdro.bio/ https://kodi.bio/.

My 10 year old son comes over for a visit. He wants to play Elf Bowling 7. No problem. I'll just install Wine and play Elf Bowling 7, right? No dice. The game runs, but very poorly and only displays about a 1 inch screen in upper left hand corner of my 50" TV. Snap! Fought with the Wine settings for over an hour and never got anything better than a 5 inch window in the middle of my screen which ran even worse.

No problem. Search the Linux software library for a bowling came. The closest thing I found was Stella running the Atari 2600 version of "Bowling". Ouch!

Any other games that a 10 year old would be interested in playing that will work in Linux? Not really.

I brought up my weekly shopping list in OpenOffice. Looks like crap! All kinds of formatting errors. Certainly Office 97 would look better than this.

So yeah. The no matter how good Linux gets. The brick wall is and will continue to be the fact that there is no good software for Linux. Wine can run certain things, but many of those certain things are either super out of date, super buggy, or both.
 


A key point to remember is that Linux is not Windows. I have to keep a laptop with windows on it to handle those things that does not transfer over to Linux. I used the laptop once a year and everything else is done on Linux. Just a heads up, most things are doable on Linux unfortunately the gaming community has not taken the plunge yet.
 

wizardfromoz

Super Moderator
Staff member
Gold Supporter
Credits
7,537
I put the love on that because I always enjoy reading a good rant, even if there are elements in it I disagree with :)

A belated welcome to linux.org @davidP7 , from DownUnder ;)

I think you have answered many of your own questions, as I expect you are aware.

Two points I would address -

1.
The brick wall is and will continue to be the fact that there is no good software for Linux.
.

Unqualified after only a few months in Linux, sorry. There is heaps of good software in Linux, and which can be customised infinitely more than in Windows, because of the open source nature of Linux.

Just noticed Hansel while writing, Snap! Hi Hansel ;)

The difficulty that Linux faces with much software is the proprietary nature of the software used for Windows, and with the Linux community being able to make adjustments to, or alternatives for ... applications eg MS Office cf LibreOffice; Games; certain audio, video and printer drivers, and on and on.

As Hansel has said

...unfortunately the gaming community has not taken the plunge yet.
More shame on them.


2. The shopping list is in that category, as are any documents that contain formulae, macros etc.

Do you have PlayOnLinux installed with the Wine?

If not

http://wiki.playonlinux.com/index.php/Installing_PlayOnLinux

... and a good read if you will take the time, is

https://linux.oneandoneis2.org/LNW.htm

There are over 400 Linux out there, chances are small that you cannot find one that checks most of your boxes. I run 56 of them - love 'em

Cheers

Chris Turner
wizardfromoz
 

70 Tango Charlie

Well-Known Member
Credits
994
@davidP7 @wizardfromoz @Condobloke
Welcome DavidP7!
Being a Windows guy from about 1993 until about 5 years ago, let me give my opinion of Linux' strong points and weak points from an old Geezers' point of view.

I used Office from 97 up to about 2014. For what I need - which is word processing and spreadsheets I find that LibreOffice is much better than MS office, and it is free. Much of it is compatible with MS office.

Email, web browsing, etc is just as good or better as one can do with MS or Apple.

Being 86, I don't get into games too much, so that one is not of concern to me. {However, if I were, I would get a cheap laptop with windows on it and use it just for games. Shucks, laptops are really cheap today compared to 10 years ago.}

Linux today is 'not your father's Linux'. It is so much more user friendly than it used to be that there is no comparison.

I am getting acquainted with C programming just to see how programs are constructed, not to become a programmer. I also like the freedom to experiment with whatever strikes my fancy. Try that with Windows!

I do the updates on my time schedule, not when MS decides to update 'their' system on the computer that I 'lease' from them. As you can see from this:

Updates.png

my system is up to date, and not waiting until MS decides to update the cp.

That is not all, but there are literally hundreds of different programs to do just about anything you want to do on Linux; and most all of them are free.

Did I mention Anti-Virus programs? I know that there are some out there; but in the 4-5 years I have used Linux Mint {and others} I have never had a virus nor have I used any Anti-Virus program. Try that with Windows!!! Please don't, as you would most certainly be sorry if you did.

Oh yes, then there is the need to de-frag your Windows system to keep the speed from slowing down too much. No need in Linux. They do file systems differently than Windows does. It's evident that Linux's way is better.

Wow, is the Old Geezer getting windy - again. LOL.
Anyhow,
Once again, welcome and enjoy your stay.
Just call me Old Geezer, Tango Charlie
 

Condobloke

Well-Known Member
Credits
5,096
davidP7 said:
So yeah. The no matter how good Linux gets. The brick wall is and will continue to be the fact that there is no good software for Linux.
G'day David, lol to the above statement.

That is as good a joke as I have heard today

You are a lucky man....lucky the people at this forum are intelligent, sane, and overall the best natured people I have ever come across on a forum.

If you wish to learn, please stay and join this happy, well informed bunch of people.
 

sam444

Member
Credits
318
I miss Windoze too.

I miss the Blue Screen of Death, Spyware, Viruses, Updates that screw your System, Updates that use your Broadband to install updates on other peoples computers, Secret Backdoors that allow micro$oft to see everything on your computer and Delete or change anything they like.

Then there's micro$ofts EULA, which is about 50 pages that can be summed up in just a few words..."Do as We Say Or Else".

You pay a large fee to rent Windoze because you don't own it and m$ can cancel your licence at anytime for any reason.

Then there's Linux, I run Linux Mint Cinnamon 19.1 on my Tower and Linux Lite on my Laptop...everything works, nothing breaks, it's everything I'll ever need and I can do what ever I like.
 

wizardfromoz

Super Moderator
Staff member
Gold Supporter
Credits
7,537
:) @davidP7 - take no offence where none is intended, and you are certainly not under attack.

I put a Love on Sam's offering above, because it succinctly expresses some of my own thoughts on the subject.

I have been helping in Linux Forums for 6 years since I gave away Windows (no regrets) and if I read concerns such as your (valid to your eyes, and needs) concerns maybe once a week on a quiet week, that would be over 300 times :).

I don't get into games too much, so that one is not of concern to me. {However, if I were, I would get a cheap laptop with windows on it and use it just for games.
I would go with Charlie's advice for your son, and rewrite the shopping list under LibreOffice, which can be saved in an MS format.

Cheers

Wizard
 

captain-sensible

Well-Known Member
Credits
7,571
@davidP7 have you tried saying to your son " Windows is for people that play games, whereas Linux is where you learn to code games, that other people play ?" i'm not holding my breadth on this one but worth a try ?

python and livewires will get you started
 

captain-sensible

Well-Known Member
Credits
7,571
I miss Windoze too.

I miss the Blue Screen of Death, Spyware, Viruses, Updates that screw your System, Updates that use your Broadband to install updates on other peoples computers, Secret Backdoors that allow micro$oft to see everything on your computer and Delete or change anything they like.

Then there's micro$ofts EULA, which is about 50 pages that can be summed up in just a few words..."Do as We Say Or Else".

You pay a large fee to rent Windoze because you don't own it and m$ can cancel your licence at anytime for any reason.

Then there's Linux, I run Linux Mint Cinnamon 19.1 on my Tower and Linux Lite on my Laptop...everything works, nothing breaks, it's everything I'll ever need and I can do what ever I like.
the one i miss is where it "amost" used to say , you have committed a crime- Windows will now close or words to that effect
 

f33dm3bits

Gold Member
Gold Supporter
Credits
7,568
@davidP7 have you tried saying to your son " Windows is for people that play games, whereas Linux is where you learn to code games, that other people play ?" i'm not holding my breadth on this one but worth a try ?

python and livewires will get you started
Welcome @davidP7!
Most people use Libreoffice now days, openoffice seems to be a thing of the past and don't hear much of the project anymore.

It has gotten easier compared to 10 years ago when it was a lot harder to get things working and you had a lot less options, so Linux is not only for coding.
 
Last edited:

jglen490

Well-Known Member
Credits
3,076
There was one during the boot sequence, back in antiquity, that said something like Your Keyboard is not Connected, Press F2 for More Options.
 

sam444

Member
Credits
318
I have a few more like these. :)

I think the OP is frustrated because they haven't found the right Distro, Some are hard to understand and use as I've found. Then I found Linux Mint, user friendly, easy to use, doesn't break and is very stable.

After a short time using Linux, you realise it's not that hard and is so much better than Windoze...just give it time.
 

Condobloke

Well-Known Member
Credits
5,096
the past I have been a desktop Linux naysayer, but I think most of my objections regarding using Linux on the desktop have been fully addressed or at least greatly mitigated. There are versions of desktop Linux that are all over the map in every category. The two that seem to be the overall most consistent, compatible, and reliable are Manjaro and Ubuntu. Those are the two that I am referring to when I say "desktop linux". Not the ones that refuse to boot ever again after I change my desktop resolution, take over a minute to boot on modern hardware, or crash when I open Google Chrome.
Gday again David, I can only imagine you may have found the responses to be somewhat overwhelming.
Let’s focus on the positive......after all, you came here for a good reason.

Please tell us what you would like to learn/understand/fix/....etc
 

KGIII

Well-Known Member
Credits
3,436
I have been pondering a way to say this politically since I saw when this was still a 0 comment thread.

See, to me it sounds like this:

"I don't know how to do what I want to do, I refuse to learn, and I will blame something other than myself for the lack of immediate gratification."

When you first used Windows, you had no idea what you were doing. It is no more intuitive than Linux. You didn't intuit your way to aptitude - you learned. You put effort in. You tried, you failed, you tried anew, you read, you poked, whatever...

When you choose to move to Linux, it means doing all that all over again. You're committing yourself to learn new things, 'cause Linux ain't Windows (and that's a good thing).

The brick wall you ran into was one of your own creation. It was you who opted to not learn. It was you who opted to not tinker until you figured it out. It was you who pouted, stomped your feet, and refused to put the effort in.

You can either sit and pout, or you can climb that wall. It makes not one iota of difference to me what you decide. Everyone here has managed to make Linux work for them - as have millions of others. Not one of us started using Linux and immediately knew how to make it work for us.

You fell down and skinned your knee. Well, get up kid, 'cause everybody's laughing at you and the biggest bruise is to your ego. You can learn to use Linux if you want. You just have to put the effort in.
 

Eugor

Member
Credits
174
Most people use Libreoffice now days, openoffice seems to be a thing of the past and don't hear much of the project anymore.

I agree with using Libreoffice. I have used both over the years, and IMO, have found that Libreoffice seems to maintain formatting and appearance much better, especially the latest versions. I have also found that the tweaks listed here improve the useability and appearance even more. https://easylinuxtipsproject.blogspot.com/p/libre-office.html
I don't game on the computer, so I can't speak to that.
My idea of good gaming is an analog pinball machine that actually knocks on wood when you get a free game. Been a while since I have been gaming.
 


Members online

No members online now.

Latest posts

Top